The colour of glass in antiquity

[WotWotius]

Hello again. I am not really sure whether or not I should put this in the archaeology or lingua latina section, but here goes...

 

The other day I was thumbing through Horace's Fons Bandusiae and I came across some interesting food for thought. In the poem, the spring is described as splendidior vitro, often translated as 'more clear/bright than glass'. This is a rather curious translation as I am under the impression that Roman glass was neither bright nor clear - indeed glass from Horace's time seems to have been quite a murky affair. One possible remedy to this could be to look what glass represented in antiquity.

 

Glass was often seen to be a luxury item, and thus splendior can be translated with its alternate definition: 'more ostentatious/luxurious'.

 

Another way in which the initial translation could be doctored is by looking at the word for glass. The Latin word for glass (vitrum) is also the word for woad, both of which, I believe, were blue in colour - in particular, the untreated Aqua glass of Horace's time. The very fact that the poet is using glass as a simile could be hinting at the fountain's blue hue. The clause can argueably be translated as 'more spectacular than the blue glass hue'... or something like that.

 

I have realised that thus far I have presented the above as fact. I am in fact just musing as a result of my insomnia - my knowledge in both the area of etymology and the seriation of Roman glass is bordering on ignorance. Does anybody have anything to add to this?

[Nephele]

I'm not sure how helpful this might be, but Pliny the Elder in Book 36 of his Natural History includes a chapter on the various kinds of glass, and their manufacture.

 

Pliny mentions (at least, in the English translation provided by Bostock and Riley) how a mass called "hammonitrum" is submitted to fusion and eventually "becomes a mass of pure, white glass."

 

Here's the link at Perseus:

 

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext...lin.+Nat.+36.66

 

-- Nephele

[Kosmo]

Does anybody have anything to add to this?

 

Glass, in the early stages of glass making, was green as the spring. The technology to make clear glass was just starting in Syria. The first to make colorless glass were the British during the Industrial Revolution. Usually coarse glass is still green.

[Maladict]

The Romans were fully capable of creating clear, colourless glass from at least the early empire onward.

Edited March 10, 2009 by Maladict

[WotWotius]

The Romans were fully capable of creating clear, colourless glass from at least the early empire onward.

 

What is your evidence for this?

[Maladict]

What is your evidence for this?

 

I've excavated plenty of it. No pictures though, you're going to have to take my word for it

Here is an interesting link, it mentions colourless glass somewhere.

[Nephele]

In January of 2007 I visited the University of Pennsylvania Museum to see the Amarna exhibit (which was traveling at the time and I think this was the closest museum to me that was to be hosting it). While there, I snapped a few pics of some of the U. of Penn. Museum's permanent exhibits, and I just found this pic I took of one of the ancient glass exhibits:

 

 

Of interest to you may be this site on Roman glass, hosted by the U. of Penn. Museum:

 

Glassmaking in Roman Times

 

If you check out the link on Colorless Glass, and click on the pages that follow, you'll see examples of what Maladict was talking about. The second page of the "Colorless Glass" section shows an illustration of a wall painting from a villa at Oplontis near Pompeii (mid 1st century BCE) which depicts a clear glass bowl containing apples.

 

-- Nephele

[Lost_Warrior]

I personally have a piece of what is (claimed to be) Ancient Roman glass. It's set into a bracelet. It's got the iridescent sheen on it, of course, but it was obviously at one point, clear.

 

Roman Glass

[Bryaxis Hecatee]

I've seen bactrian glass from the Afghanistan National Museum when they came to Paris some years ago and they had magnificent painted white glass in large vases forms, dating from the 1st century AD

 

 

( http://www.guimet.fr/afghanistan )

 

 

( http://robertarood.wordpress.com/2008/08/2...l-museum-kabul/ )

[Melvadius]

What is your evidence for this?

 

I've excavated plenty of it. No pictures though, you're going to have to take my word for it

Here is an interesting link, it mentions colourless glass somewhere.

 

I also have excavated my share of 'clear' Roman glass but you may also be interested in some experimental work which was carried out on Roman glass blowing techniques back in 2005 and 2006. Full details of the project can be found at the following link:

 

http://www.romanglassmakers.co.uk/

 

It is worth noting that the experimenters made use of surplus excavated Roman glass, including some 'clear' glass (I understand supplied by Molas) to form the basis of their experiment. I don't know the precise mechanics but you really need some broken glass to form the basis of any new glass products.

 

Melvadius

[caldrail]

I remember a tv program that showed an archaeologist pulling glass out of the mud and showing the blue colour, telling the presenter it was typical of roman glass.

 

Whereas I don't doubt 'clear' glass was possible, that wouldn't mean it was cheap or commonly available. I got the impression from the program, right or wrong, that blue glass was used for windows - which implies a wealthier inhabitant able to afford glass to begin with.

[Maladict]

I remember a tv program that showed an archaeologist pulling glass out of the mud and showing the blue colour, telling the presenter it was typical of roman glass.

 

Whereas I don't doubt 'clear' glass was possible, that wouldn't mean it was cheap or commonly available. I got the impression from the program, right or wrong, that blue glass was used for windows - which implies a wealthier inhabitant able to afford glass to begin with.

 

The greenish-blue colour is the natural colour of glass, so if you don't need it to look a certain way (e.g. windows) that's probably what you'd use.

As for being wealthy, I'm pretty sure the lower classes used it too, as it turns up in such large amounts all over the place, especially considering it can be recycled whereas pottery cannot. Not sure about windows though.

[WotWotius]

This is all fantastic stuff, guys. Thank you.

[Lost_Warrior]

I don't know the precise mechanics but you really need some broken glass to form the basis of any new glass products.

 

If this is true (and I'm not saying it's not) how was the first glass made? How is the growing demand for glass met?

[caldrail]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_glass