three questions RE Caesar

[frankq]

three questions RE Caesar:

 

When exactly did he start wearing the purple robe? After Thapsus or Munda?

 

Secondly, I have read opposing arguments that he used or didnt use the title imperator officially, which is it?

 

Thirdly, Appian states that statues of him were put in all the temples. This is an exaggeration?

 

Does anyone have a list handy of the chronology of Caesar's honors? I did a search and can't find one.

[Publius Nonius Severus]

three questions RE Caesar:

 

When exactly did he start wearing the purple robe? After Thapsus or Munda?

 

Secondly, I have read opposing arguments that he used or didnt use the title imperator officially, which is it?

 

Thirdly, Appian states that statues of him were put in all the temples. This is an exaggeration?

 

Does anyone have a list handy of the chronology of Caesar's honors? I did a search and can't find one.

 

I cannot answer two and three, but for the first, Smith states:

 

Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology, Vol 1, p. 553

 

The senate received him with the most servile flattery. They had in his absence voted a public thanksgiving of fifty days on account of his victory in Spain, and various other honorary de

[frankq]

Yes I recently read that in Smith's work and it somehow escaped me again. Attempting to compile and frame data on Caesar is a burdensome task. Thanks for the reminder! It's a great website, Smith's dictionaries, isn't it?

[Publius Nonius Severus]

...Thanks for the reminder! It's a great website, Smith's dictionaries, isn't it?

 

I agree completely! In nearly all cases they are the first place I look when I want to look something up or get refreshed. Considering how comprehensive his dictionaries are, that they are online at various places (Lacus Curtius, Google Books, Ancient Library, and the Univ of Mich.), they have excellent source references, and they are free...they are absolutely invaluable tools in any student of Roman history!

[Primus Pilus]

three questions RE Caesar:

Secondly, I have read opposing arguments that he used or didnt use the title imperator officially, which is it?

 

There certainly is coinage issued by Caesar with the title IMP or IMPER in the obverse legend to indicate officialism. Whether this is proof that the title was used in other official capacities is difficult to discern.

 

The legend IMP appears as early as 47 BC

http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/sear5/s1401.html

 

The first coins with Caesar's portrait (which was of course a shocking display of regal behavior) and the inclusion of the titles IMPER or IMP on the obverse legend appear just before his assassination in Jan/Feb of 44 BC

http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/sear5/s1408.html

http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/sear5/s1419.html

[The Augusta]

Regarding the question of the title Imperator - if it's any help, the Fasti do not record the use of the name by Caesar in his consulships of 48 and 46-44. Interestingly, they do record this title with regard to Octavian/Augustus from 33BC onwards. So, regardless of coinage, the fact that the Fasti makes this distinction would incline me to think that Caesar's use of 'Imperator' was not a part of his official nomenclature, as it was with Octavian/Augustus.

[frankq]

Regarding the question of the title Imperator - if it's any help, the Fasti do not record the use of the name by Caesar in his consulships of 48 and 46-44. Interestingly, they do record this title with regard to Octavian/Augustus from 33BC onwards. So, regardless of coinage, the fact that the Fasti makes this distinction would incline me to think that Caesar's use of 'Imperator' was not a part of his official nomenclature, as it was with Octavian/Augustus.

 

This verifies the historian Ballard, who claims he did not officially adopt the title.

[Publius Nonius Severus]

Regarding the question of the title Imperator - if it's any help, the Fasti do not record the use of the name by Caesar in his consulships of 48 and 46-44. Interestingly, they do record this title with regard to Octavian/Augustus from 33BC onwards. So, regardless of coinage, the fact that the Fasti makes this distinction would incline me to think that Caesar's use of 'Imperator' was not a part of his official nomenclature, as it was with Octavian/Augustus.

 

This verifies the historian Ballard, who claims he did not officially adopt the title.

 

Eventhough "Imperator" is not mentioned specificallu, Cassius Dio presents evidence that Caesar did not always employe every title he had, which I think makes the argument stronger:

 

Cassius Dio, Roman History, Book XLIII, Chap 46.

 

These were the measures that were passed in honour of his victory (I do not mention all, but as many as have seemed to me notable), not in one day, to be sure, but just as it happened, at different times. Caesar began to avail himself of some, and was intending to use others in the future, however emphatically he declined some of them. Thus he took the office of consul immediately, even before entering the city, but did not hold it through the whole year; instead, when he got to Rome he renounced it, turning it over to

[Gaius Paulinus Maximus]

Regarding the question of the title Imperator - if it's any help, the Fasti do not record the use of the name by Caesar in his consulships of 48 and 46-44. Interestingly, they do record this title with regard to Octavian/Augustus from 33BC onwards. So, regardless of coinage, the fact that the Fasti makes this distinction would incline me to think that Caesar's use of 'Imperator' was not a part of his official nomenclature, as it was with Octavian/Augustus.

 

Found this on Livius.org......

 

 

......There were more Roman generals who used imperator in inscriptions, but it is not clear whether they had received the title by acclamation, or used it as synonym for their titles (e.g., proconsul). However, the title was certainly awarded to Sulla, who started to count his imperatorial acclamations on his coins (L. SVLLA IMPER. ITERVM). Later, the Senate started to offer the title to generals too, as an indication that they had official powers (imperium). In inscriptions, a parallel development is attested: commanders started to combine the names of their offices with their imperatorial title (e.g, consul imperator).

 

For Julius Caesar, imperator no longer was a commemoration of a victory, but an indication of his absolute, dictatorial military power, and could even be used as part of his name: C. CAESARE IMP. . During the civil wars after Caesar's death, Octavian, whose real name was -since his adoption- Gaius Julius Caesar, started to call himself Imperator Julius Caesar, as if imperator was a first name. Later, he was simply known as Imperator Caesar: a man without name of his own. This was made official by law in 29 BCE and could even be combined with the number of imperatorial acclamations, like : IMP. CAESARI DIVI F. IMP. V). Two years later, Octavian settled for Imperator Caesar Augustus - three words that all became synonym of 'emperor'.

Edited September 19, 2007 by Gaius Paulinus Maximus

[frankq]

All interesting replies. Thanks. But everyone has attacked the 2nd question while basically not addressing the first and third.

 

And if anybody out there knowns of a list and chronology of titles bestowed upon Caesar, I'd be grateful if you provide the Link.

 

I actually had one but seemed to have lost the bookmark. It was on a French website devoted to Mommsen. I was rather sceptical about the info, I don't know why. It said that as part of Caesar's honors, he was given 70 lictors.

[frankq]

All interesting replies. Thanks. But everyone has attacked the 2nd question while basically not addressing the first and third.

 

And if anybody out there knowns of a list and chronology of titles bestowed upon Caesar, I'd be grateful if you provide the Link.

 

I actually had one but seemed to have lost the bookmark. It was on a French website devoted to Mommsen. I was rather sceptical about the info, I don't know why. It said that as part of Caesar's honors, he was given 70 lictors.

 

I found it again, but it isnt in outline form. For those of you versed in French it's well worth a look:

 

http://perso.orange.fr/textes.histoire/Mom...ppend_09_HR.htm

 

On his final return to Rome Mommsen states that he took imperator as a title for himself and his successor. This seems contradicted by separate measures Augustus and the Senate took to attach the title to his name. And contradicted by Ballard, a source I usually trust. Mind you, I assume this chronolgy is a compilation by the editors, not Mommsen.

Edited September 20, 2007 by frankq

[ASCLEPIADES]

Thirdly, Appian states that statues of him were put in all the temples. This is an exaggeration?

Salve!

 

I can't read Greek, but relying on the Loeb translation, here comes Appian, Bellum Civilis, Liber II, Ch. CVI:

 

"...Caesar having ended the civil wars hastened to Rome, honoured and feared as no one had ever been before. All kinds of honours were devised for his gratification without stint, even such as were divine

[Gladius Hispaniensis]

Salve

Regarding Caesar's use of Imperator - would it then be technically correct to date the end of the Republic with Caesar instead of with Octavius as is usually done?

[Publius Nonius Severus]

Salve

Regarding Caesar's use of Imperator - would it then be technically correct to date the end of the Republic with Caesar instead of with Octavius as is usually done?

A little OT, but...If you are refereing to the use of the term "Imperator" as akin to "Emperor", I would say no. If you mean was this the defining moment that marked the end of the Republic...perhaps? There has been a lot of debate of what event/date marked the actual end of the Republic. Some months ago our Cato asked the question in a different thread:

 

Who killed the Republic?

 

Here's the quote:

 

In contrast, when (and in what) do we observe the "fall" of the republic?

 

-In 59, with activation of the "Three Headed Monster"?

-In 49, when Caesar marched on Rome?

-In 48, after Pharsalus?

-In 46, after Utica?

-In 45, after Munda?

-In 44, after Caesar's assassination?

-In 43, when the lex Titia sanctioned a junta to create a new constitution?

-In 42, after Philippi?

-In 31, after Actium?

-In 28, when public affairs were handed back to the Senate and People of Rome?

-In 27, when public affairs were again handed back to the Senate and People of Rome?

-In 23, when Augustus took the title of Princeps?

-In 14, when Tiberius took the title of Princeps in monarchical fashion and effectively abolished popular election to the magistracies?

[ASCLEPIADES]

Salve!

Based on Smith's Dictionary of Greek and Roman Antiquities (pg. 628-629):

 

"The mixtum Imperium was nothing more than the power necessary for giving effect to the Jurisdictio. There might therefore be Imperium without Jurisdictio, but there could be no Jurisdictio without Imperium.

Accordingly, Imperium is sometimes used to express the authority of a magistratus, of which his Juris

Edited September 20, 2007 by ASCLEPIADES