CiceroD Posted September 16, 2007 Report Share Posted September 16, 2007 BEFORE you post please at least think about my arguement. This is a philosophical discussion and I know it is contentious. In my many discussions with friends in the Christian Fellowship on campus, whenever I ask how they can simply ignore the science of geology the answer is always in the vein of "God Created it that Way" some examples Q. What about the layers of Rocks that indicate gradual deposition of material over millions of years? A. God created the rocks in layers. It is equally plausible Q. How can fossils be from the Great flood when the amount of Argon in their bones indicated they died millions of years in the past? A. God adjusted the amount of that so as not to offer physical proof of his existance. my favorite Q. the stars are billions of light years away. If they were created thousands of years ago with the earth then we wouldn't see most of them A. God created the light on the way to earth so that we could see them I understand the "God didn't want physical proof of his existence" explanation but if so much of the world was created specifically to trick us. Then Christianity follows the doctrines of Gnosticism i.e. The Old Testament God (the Creator) was an evil, or at best imperfect being (God and the Devil were one) Therefore, this world is evil and we must not be led astray by any worldly indulgence. I really dont like that Theology Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Caelius Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 What your friends are essentially saying is that their god wove deception into the very fabric of Creation, intentionally designing everything to appear differently from what it really is. They are saying that their compassionate god has set humans up to fail, by giving them the ability to evaluate the evidence then consigning them to hellfire when they exercise that ability. This is a definition of divine compassion with which I have unfortunately been familiar for most of my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Q. the stars are billions of light years away. If they were created thousands of years ago with the earth then we wouldn't see most of themA. God created the light on the way to earth so that we could see them LOL. That's my favorite too. Have you ever noticed what cognitive parasites these village theologians are? By 'cognitive parasitism', I mean that the naive theology implied by the comments above comprise nothing more than cribbing the notes of scientists. In fact, none of these alleged facts about God had ever been known about God before--not until critics realized how the scientific findings did not jibe with Genesis and apologists had to reply to the critics. And the funny thing is it's heresy! After all, nothing in Genesis says that "God created the light on the way to earth so that we could see them" and nothing in science implies as much either. The only way to reach this absurd conclusion about God is by mangling scientific findings to fit the Procrustean bed of Genesis. If I were a theist (which I'm not), I'd be outraged by these stupid arguments. I'd say to the village theologian, "Genesis is just a human story about God, and I'm not going to piss off God by making Him out to be a monster just to save my great-great-great-....-great-grandfather's bedtime story." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASCLEPIADES Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 Ultimately, faith is believing without question, and science is little more than answering questions rigorously. Faith and Science had always made and will always make a bad mixture. Both of them have their right place, and it's not together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 Ask them about the digestive organs of the Leviathan that ate Iona (and Pinocchio) and about the size and life support systems of Noah's Ark. Their answers should be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiceroD Posted September 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 about the size and life support systems of Noah's Ark. Their answers should be fun. I especially love the answers to where did all the water go. "God made all the water go away" While Im glad I have support. (and that someone found my post ) Im surprised I didn't get a "your going to hell" response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primus Pilus Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 Im surprised I didn't get a "your going to hell" response. You're going to hell. Feel Better? Anyway, I'm fascinated by the similarity in this "god wishes to remain hidden" reasoning to that of alien visitors, abductions and anal probing. If these aliens are so much more advanced than us that they can engage in interstellar travel, randomly intercept hapless trailer park residents and study humanity via the rectum, why would they be concerned if we were to discover that they were actually there. If we got a bit unruly about all of this, they could just zap us with ray guns and such. Or maybe they have a Star Trek like "Prime Directive"? Oops, this was about religion, my bad... carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiceroD Posted September 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 (edited) Im surprised I didn't get a "your going to hell" response. You're going to hell. Feel Better? ;) Oops, this was about religion, my bad... carry on. Thank you according to my Godmother I should get one of those a day. Anyway your two cents are welcome! and I'll take this one step further, What's up with the atlantis people? I mean the ONLY REPUTABLE (if even that) source of it is Plato Edited September 18, 2007 by CiceroD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Caelius Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 What's up with the atlantis people? I mean the ONLY source of it is Plato Wrong. The only ancient source is Plato. Edgar Cayce et al are/were quite modern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiceroD Posted September 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 What's up with the atlantis people? I mean the ONLY source of it is Plato Wrong. The only ancient source is Plato. Edgar Cayce et al are/were quite modern. sorry thanks for correcting me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caldrail Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 (edited) Q. the stars are billions of light years away. If they were created thousands of years ago with the earth then we wouldn't see most of themA. God created the light on the way to earth so that we could see them LOL. That's my favorite too. Have you ever noticed what cognitive parasites these village theologians are? By 'cognitive parasitism', I mean that the naive theology implied by the comments above comprise nothing more than cribbing the notes of scientists. In fact, none of these alleged facts about God had ever been known about God before--not until critics realized how the scientific findings did not jibe with Genesis and apologists had to reply to the critics. And the funny thing is it's heresy! After all, nothing in Genesis says that "God created the light on the way to earth so that we could see them" and nothing in science implies as much either. The only way to reach this absurd conclusion about God is by mangling scientific findings to fit the Procrustean bed of Genesis. If I were a theist (which I'm not), I'd be outraged by these stupid arguments. I'd say to the village theologian, "Genesis is just a human story about God, and I'm not going to piss off God by making Him out to be a monster just to save my great-great-great-....-great-grandfather's bedtime story." I agree absolutely, utterly, and completely. This sort of rationalising is wallpapering over the cracks to justify a two thousand year belief structure that now looks anachronistic and inconsistent. Funny thing is, the same rationalising must have been used back then - humans haven't changed much over the millenia after all - which to me is positive proof of just how many fakers and con-artists were duping ordinary well-meaning people. That sort of thing goes on today. We see religious leaders growing fat and wealthy on the back of their own particular cult. Listen to Jesus He Knows Me by Genesis. That kind of says it all. Edited November 24, 2007 by caldrail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klingan Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Q. How can fossils be from the Great flood when the amount of Argon in their bones indicated they died millions of years in the past? A. God adjusted the amount of that so as not to offer physical proof of his existance. He.y he wants us all to worship him, some physical evidence would do just the trick I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Caelius Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 We interupt this thread for some really heavy-duty theological news: "This is not a joke. The Flying Spaghetti Monster has appeared to us in a pumpkin pie. Bless his noodley appendages!" Full Story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spittle Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 I am about to pour holy water into my monitor to save all your blaspheming souls. If it ruins my computer then you'll all burn in hell!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian the Faithful Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 (edited) I have been reading "Against the Galileans", by Julian. He literally picks apart their religion with words from their own book. It was something to read. You should read that and ask some of them the following question. But as for the commandment "Thou shalt not worship other gods," to this surely he adds a terrible libel upon God. "For I am a jealous God," he says, and in another place again, "Our God is a consuming fire." Then if a man is jealous and envious you think him blameworthy, whereas if God is called jealous you think it a divine quality? And yet how is it reasonable to speak falsely of God in a matter that is so evident? For if he is indeed jealous, then against his will are all other gods worshipped, and against his will do all the remaining nations worship their gods. Then how is it that he did not himself restrain them, if he is so jealous and does not wish that the others should be worshipped, but only himself? Can it be that he was not able to do so, or did he not wish even from the beginning to prevent the other gods also from being worshipped? However, the first explanation is impious, to say, I mean, that he was unable; and the second is in accordance with what we do ourselves. Lay aside this nonsense and do not draw down on yourselves such terrible blasphemy. For if it is God's will that none other should be worshipped, why do you worship this spurious son of his whom he has never yet recognised or considered as his own? This I shall easily prove. You, however, I know not why, foist on him a counterfeit son. . . . If anything, you will see some mad people! They hate the inconsistencies of their own work, especially when you use reason and intellect in exposing them. I always tell my friends that I do not need to make up lies about Christianity, the Good Book does that enough. Edited November 27, 2007 by Julian the Faithful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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