Roman Coin Values

[Marcus Caelius]

A few weeks ago, I picked up a coin from Vespasian's reign: http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...si&img=1772 (how do you post images? The "Insert Image" button doesn't seem to work).

 

It's not silver (I don't think), but it is silver-colored, and I'm told the silvering was added to increase it's monetary value. This doesn't make sense to me, any more than does the modern practice of colorizing circulating coins to try and turn them into collectors' items.

 

So, what is the coin likely made of, and what would be the difference in value if it were bronze? Or actually silver.

 

BTW, I was surprised at how tiny it is, about the size of my little fingertip.

[Maladict]

A few weeks ago, I picked up a coin from Vespasian's reign: http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...si&img=1772 (how do you post images? The "Insert Image" button doesn't seem to work).

 

It's not silver (I don't think), but it is silver-colored, and I'm told the silvering was added to increase it's monetary value. This doesn't make sense to me, any more than does the modern practice of colorizing circulating coins to try and turn them into collectors' items.

 

So, what is the coin likely made of, and what would be the difference in value if it were bronze? Or actually silver.

 

BTW, I was surprised at how tiny it is, about the size of my little fingertip.

 

I think this is your coin, even though it says cos VI instead of IV. (I have a sneaking suspicion yours does too)

The denarius was a silver coin, but is but gradually debased until, by the time of the third century, it was almost completely made of copper. It had to look like it was silver, though, hence the silver-colored wash. So the silvering was added to make it acceptable as a silver coin.

 

About the value, it's hard to say because of the varying silver content.

Most importantly, the value depends largely on the state of preservation.

Edited July 1, 2007 by Maladict

[Ingsoc]

Try posting it at this forum:

 

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php

[Primus Pilus]

It's silver, just not pure silver. The composition of Flavian era denarii was still in the area of 90% pure though.

 

A "silvered" coin is actually a contemporary counterfeit called a Fouree. The processes varied but all included adding a small economical amount of silver to a coin of another metal. If the base metal of the coin (copper, bronze, etc.) is not visible via any cracked or corroded areas of the "silver plating" identification can be difficult. Some use coin weight to help determine a fouree as silver is heavier than copper, but denarius weight can fluctuate. Generally though, a Flavian era Denarius will be more than the 3.0 grams that your coin is. A true denarius would typically be in the 3.2 to 3.5 grams area, but this alone is not definitive.

[Klingan]

The value of an ancient coin given in any modern currency would be inaccurate, since our life standard is so much higher. The only information I've got on roman prices is from the early 4th century, Diocletianus price edict. (Max prices allowed, by the penalty of death)

 

Work:

 

Farm laborer, with meals, daily: 25 denarii

Painter, walls, with daily meals: 75 denarii

Barber, per man: 2 denarii

 

Prices for:

Shoes, Patrician: 150 denarii

Shoes, senatorial: 100 denarii

Shoes, woman's : 60 denarii

 

Pork, 1 pound: 12 denarii

Goose, fattened, one pound: 200 denarii.

 

Now this is quite late and the inflation was really bad so it's not really equivalent to your coin. Around the time 50 bc the senetorial fortun was a minimum of 800.000 sesterces (4 sesterce = 1 denarii) and a rank-and-file soldier was paid 900 sesterces per year. At the time of Pliny the Younger a soldier earned 1200 sesterces per year.

[Marcus Caelius]

It's silver, just not pure silver. The composition of Flavian era denarii was still in the area of 90% pure though.

 

Hmm... A modern US commemorative silver dollar is 90% silver, 10% copper; 1-oz silver eagles (face value $1) are 99% silver. I have an 8-real piece off a Spanish treasure ship which is 90+% silver (I'm at work, now, so can't check weight and size).

 

This is not really pertinent to anything; just comparing. It's nice to know, though, that my Vespasian fits the definition of actual silver coinage.

[Primus Pilus]

The value of the "silvered" coin in the ancient marketplace theoretically would have been the same as a denarius... provided the ruse wasn't discovered. That was the intention after all. We might presume that they could fetch slightly more value than a similar weighing copper coin, but not nearly so much as a true silver denarius.

 

However, Pliny the Elder references counterfeits in Natural Histories...

 

Book XXXIII, ch. XXXXVI

The Triumvir Antonius alloyed the silver denarius with iron: and in spurious coin there is an alloy of copper employed. Some, again, curtail the proper weight of our denarii, the legitimate proportion being eighty-four denarii to a pound of silver. It was in consequence of these frauds that a method was devised of assaying the denarius: the law ordaining which was so much to the taste of the plebeians, that in every quarter of the City there was a full-length statue erected6 in honour of Marius Gratidianus. It is truly marvellous, that in this art, and in this only, the various methods of falsification should be made a study: for the sample of the false denarius is now an object of careful examination, and people absolutely buy the counterfeit coin at the price of many genuine ones.

 

Interestingly, while Pliny may be suggesting that the counterfeits were purchased in order to study the differences between legitimate and fake coinage, he may also be suggesting that ancient Romans collected coinage as a form of art much as we do today. Consider that a Roman living in the 1st century AD could collect a Republican era coin that was several hundred years old, just as we might (and do) collect coins from recent generations.

[Guest emily07]

There three main coins that hunted down by experienced and determined coin collectors, Roman, Greek & Chinese coins. Those three civilizations are considered to be epitome of all coins. Ancient Greek coins have variety of attributes that enable differentiation between the currencies of individual poleis. Each polis independently designed & created its own coins, with symbols that were representative of deities and heroes important to that particular government. This theme supersedes all of other trends in Greek coin making throughout the centuries.

 

Collectibles

[GhostOfClayton]

For completeness, here is the photo of the originally mentioned coin:

 

[guy]

For completeness, here is the photo of the originally mentioned coin:

 

 

Since I'm not a coin collector, I depend on others for their insight and research into coins. I appreciate the images.

 

I agree with Maladict that the Wildwinds databank is an excellent resource for both expert and novice collectors:

 

http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/ric/vespasian/t.html

 

 

Ref Vespasian Denarius, RIC 772, (RIC [1962] 90), RSC 366, BMC 161

Vespasian Denarius. 75 AD. IMP CAESAR VESPASIANVS AVG, laureate head right / PON MAX TR P COS VI, Pax seated left holding branch. RSC 366.

 

IMP: Imperator

AVG: Augustus

PON MAX: Pontifex Maximus "high priest"

TR P: Tribuniciae Potestate "power of the Tribune"

COS VI: Consul sixth time

 

Attributing coins can sometimes be difficult. In this case, the image of Vespasian (and his nose) is very distinct. Also important, of course, is being able to decipher the coin inscription.

 

 

guy also known as gaius

Edited January 8, 2011 by guy