The Roman Empire Impacts...

[Zeke]

Rome the name brings greatness,

Rome the center of the world for almost four centuries,

The bringer of peace throughout the world at one time the rest of the world being a bunch of ruthless Barbarians.

Rome the center of Philosphy, culture, arts, baths, ampitherters, imperial libaries and the collesueem. (Hope I spelt that right)

Rome one of the greatest empires in the whole world, greater then the greed of Genis Kahans bloodthirsty hords, greater then the all the Christian Empires thrown together, smarter then Napoeleon's France, more culturally enlightened then Freedom loving America, more religiouly tolereant then the Ottaman Turks, the first great Republic after Greek City States, and of coarse the spreader of Classical Greek cutlure throughout the Mediterrean. Who could not like Rome..... I think it was probally the most best known empires in the world and I certainlly marvel at Rome.

 

But then there are those people who hate Rome........Those who say it was a monster that destoryed cutlures and murder of Jesus Christ, (which was by the way instugated by the Jews not the Romans). Those who say it was a mess of back stabbing politics and greedy Emporers, and a grand army that killed alot of people. An empire that eveyone citizens but failed to make everyone equal.

 

I have a question for everyone...........Do you think Rome was great and was one of the best places to live in the world at the time, and all together the best thing at the time.....or do you think it was a corrupt Empire that was responisble for killing Jesus on the cross and for esatablishing a dictorial system of goverence over many people?

 

I personally like Rome and I admire it greatly.

 

How about you? what do you think about Rome.........what if Rome had never existed??? What if Rome had been destoryed by Carthage perhaps or Ceaser had not won in Gaul? Do you think it was good or bad...or if you are in the middle explain points of the bad things about it or the bad things.

Details.

sorry about spelling

Blessings,

Zeke the Celt.

[Ursus]

I'm not a Christian, so Christian arguments against Rome mean little to me.

 

Since Christianity owes much to Greco-Roman civilization, I don't see how any educated Christian can not see the the Roman Empire as part of Christianity's legacy -- the murder of this alleged god-man Jesus notwithstanding.

 

Rome has had an unfair reputation for years as an Evil Empire. The truth is Rome was far more civilized and tolerant than most of the Empires that came before or after.

 

As far as influence on the Western world, let's see ...

 

* I'm using Caesar's calendar (more or less).

* I'm writing in the Roman alphabet (more or less)

* Most of the intellectual and artistic words in English come from Greek or Latin

* My country (America) took some of it's inspiration for government from the Roman Republic

* Most of the arts and sciences familiar to Westerners had their origins in the Hellenized realms of the Roman Empire.

 

Looks like I'm largely Greco-Roman.

 

There is some Germanic influence in laguage and law, thanks to the legacy of Angleland (England). But otherwise I account myself a good Roman citizen.

[Primus Pilus]

Its pretty safe to say that I'm an admirer of Rome. Living in the ancient world would largely depend on the class status, however. I wouldn't suppose that being a heavy manual labor slave would be all that much fun.

 

Was the Empire corrupt? Sure, at times. The ancient world was no different than the modern one in this regard. Corrupt politicians or business people is a recurring theme. Judging the Roman world in a negative light on this aspect is just plain wrong, if you disregard similar conditions that exist today.

 

To discount Rome as an evil empire also discredits all the contributions it made. The Greeks were the innovators who created many of the concepts that the Romans used, but it was the Romans who gave them to the entire western world. Public sewage and plumbing, roads, medicine and other public institutions weren't surpassed in quality until the 19th and 20th centuries.

[Zeke]

intresting. I can't see why people complain abour Rome being evil! Without Rome we might just be entering the Industrial Revolution at 2004 we would be so behind without Rome

[Demson]

Hey!

 

What's wrong with evil?

 

 

I'll begin my statement with two examples:

 

Rome brought aquaducts, roads, sanitation at the cost of slavery.

 

Rome brought peace through the rule of the countless of Legions, a fighting force more ruthless then most tribal barbarians all together.

 

My point?

 

As usual, I find it almost too easy to label Rome 'good' or 'bad'. Good to who? Bad to what? Both sides usually have grounded reasons to believe Rome was either one or another.

 

I like to see the Roman era as an ancient petridish of our current humanity. It had to deal with allot of factors we have to deal with now, but technologically less complicated. There's allot we could learn from them.

 

 

I wonder what people will think of us Westerners in 2000 years from now?

[Primus Pilus]

Well said, there are 2 sides to every coin.

[Ursus]

I tend to think in terms of culture and religion, and to me cultures and religion are two sides of the same coin. So with that in mind, I look at the world through those lenses.

 

I'm something of a pagan, and I deal with pagans from other cultures all the time. Many of them don't seem overly fond of Rome. Especially the ones of a Germanic or Celtic persuausion. A lot of these people belong to some clan or "tribe" and have an insular view of the world; the more cosmopolitan and rational atmosphere is something of a threat to them I guess.

 

Then there are Jews and Christians who may have their own reasons for disliking Rome. The more educated Christians may see Christianity as a product of Greco-Roman culture, but the lesser educated ones take the "Romans murdered Jesus" viewpoint. Some Jewish people still seem sore regarding that whole destruction of the temple affair. They seem to forget that rulers like Julius Caesar treated them with kindness until they had a good reason not to.

 

All of the above mentioned groups may see Rome as "evil" for whatever reason. I merely shrug it off. I have little sympathy for their arguments.

 

Honestly I think the Greco-Roman legacy is the most significant force in the West, and perhaps the world. I certainly think it edges out all other cultural influences from the West. In time perhaps the cultures centering around Confucius and Mohammed might exert more influence on world history, but that is for the future to decide. As of now, I think it's hard to escape the Greco-Roman legacy no matter where you live.

[Zeke]

Ursus: I'm something of a pagan, and I deal with pagans from other cultures all the time. Many of them don't seem overly fond of Rome. Especially the ones of a Germanic or Celtic persuausion.

 

I seriously need proof of the Celtic Religion being destoryed by the Romans, the Romans let everyone worship their own gods they aslo brought many Celtic Gods in the Pantheon. Except Christians, I can see why they were some sort of a threat.

I being a Roman Pagan myself highly admire there system of religious tolerence by letting other Pagan Faiths in.

Cheers,

Zeke

[Primus Pilus]

I think Ursus meant that Celtic pagans dislike Rome due to its conquest of the Celtic people. Its related of course, but still a different issue than religious tolerance. Then again, I know little to nothing of paganism.

 

(by the way, nothing wrong so far, but please continue to be 'tolerant' enough not to get into various religious bashing. Open discussion of religion, especially as it relates historically, is encouraged, but we also like for our forum to be as inclusive as the Romans were. Thanks guys! =P)

[journaldan]

Even as no-questions-about-it Christian, I think anyone who takes a "The Romans (or, more likely, 'The Jews') killed Jesus" attitude is really missing the whole point of the book.

[Zeke]

Good point Prumuspilus, no religious bashing but I was just wondering where the Romans wern't religiously tolerant? I mean I understand Christians but most other Pagans were adopted into the Roman Pantheon. Another thing to this topic, did you know that the Romans wern't really rascist when it came to the idea of slavery? Almost anyone could be a slave from a Thracian or a Greek or a Slave from North Africa. When did they start jundging slavery by the color of the skin anyway?

Prumuspilus what does you name mean in Latin I am studing it at the moment,Thanks

Zeke

[Ursus]

Yes, I meant that some Celtic and Germanic pagans didn't like Rome all that much due to invasions or attempted invasions.

 

I realize pagan politics is not something that arouses great interest from the majority of people here, but I thought it was directly relevant to the general topic of Rome and its detractors, so that's why I mentioned it.

 

As far as religious tolerance, the Romans believed that every deity they encountered had to be respected, or divine retribution would fall upon them. In that sense, they were a very pious people both to their own gods and the gods of their neighbors. But if a religious cult did something to upset the social order, or somehow presented a threat to Roman rule, they rarely hesitated to restrict the activities of that cult. Religious tolerance ended where a threat to the Roman social order began.

[Primus Pilus]

When did they start jundging slavery by the color of the skin anyway?

 

 

With the European imperialism and expansion to Africa and the Americas. 15th to 17th centuries.

 

Prumuspilus what does you name mean in Latin I am studing it at the moment

 

 

Primus = Prime or First (generally translated as first)

Pilus = File (often translated as spear)

 

The Primus Pilus was the the Top ranking Centurion in the legion. He was the field commander while the Legate and his staff conducted the battle from a strategic vantage point (generally). His actual position was as the lead centurion of the first century of the first cohort.

[Spurius]

Let's see about some things Roman:

 

Religion- Near as I can tell, if you paid your taxes and didn't sacrifice people you were acceptable. Buck the order of things and the legions could put a world of hurt on you and your people. Pretty much a good thing as far as I'm concerned.

 

Armed forces - Tough, but at times too doctrinarian or poorly lead. The legions greatest contributions came not from their swords but from their spades. Roman roads built with legionnaire backs made and broke the empire

[Viggen]

Nice contribution Spurius!

 

An interesting question would be to ask, if one maybe can still see today some difference between was once Romen Empire territory and countries (areas) that never where under Roman control...

 

cheers

viggen