roman wargamer Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 actually at the foundation of Rome it is the plebian comitia. the comitia curiata- the assembly of the elders of clan, big family and the richer family below the patres. then, when do comitia centuriata only arise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caesar CXXXVII Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 actually at the foundation of Rome it is the plebian comitia. the comitia curiata- the assembly of the elders of clan, big family and the richer family below the patres. then, when do comitia centuriata only arise? The Comitia Curiata was established at the same time when Rome was united , c. 625 BCE . 3 tribes*10=30 Curi's*100=3,000 soldiers . The Comitia Centuriata was the most important part of the "Servian reforms" , the Classis , c. 550 BCE . 60 centuries of Hoplites = 6,000 heavy infantry + 24 centuries of Velites = 2,400 light infantry + 6 centuries of Equites = 600 cavalry . 8,400 / 2 = 4,200 , the historical number of soldiers in a Legion (the 193 centuries belongs to the reform of 406 BCE Var.) Than , you have the Comitia Tributa , c. 550 BCE by Tullius - That is the "Plebeian assembly" . We do not know if this assembly was the same as the Consilium Plebis of c. 490 or another one , based on it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman wargamer Posted January 3, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2007 The Comitia Curiata was established c. 625 BCEThe Comitia Centuriata was established c. 550 BCE it takes 75 years to pass before the creation of centuriata. the curiata have quasi-sovereign personality as representative of the people of each tribe. they hold the right to conferred the imperium to the elected king... it belong only to them. which centuriata do not have nor historical records say's they never ever exercise. Than , you have the Comitia Tributa , c. 550 BCE by Tullius - That is the "Plebeian assembly" . if you are claiming that the plebian do not exist until 550 bce... and only when the comitia tributa was created. then i strongly disagree on that matters. "Servian reforms" it was a way to aviod being needed to be elected by curiata to become legal king. they use the army or centuriata to hold to kingship without the imperium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caesar CXXXVII Posted January 3, 2007 Report Share Posted January 3, 2007 the curiata have quasi-sovereign personality as representative of the people of each tribe. they hold the right to conferred the imperium to the elected king... it belong only to them. Yes . which centuriata do not have nor historical records say's they never ever exercise. I did not understand if you are claiming that the plebian do not exist until 550 bce... and only when the comitia tributa was created. then i strongly disagree on that matters. No , I don't . But actualy the Plebeian movement started only in the 490' ! it was a way to aviod being needed to be elected by curiata to become legal king. They ("Servius Tullius" , "Superbus" , The Vibenna brothers , Lars Porsenna) were Tyrants and never got the Imperium from the Comitia Curiata . they use the army or centuriata to hold to kingship without the imperium. Exactly . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman wargamer Posted January 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2007 (edited) The Comitia Curiata was established c. 625 BCE on my workguess... the members of the Comitia Curiata was the Plebeian people or clan elders. so it means they begin c. 625 bce. ad initio with the federation of the 12 tribe. cause if they are not... then who are the members of the comitia curiata. if you are claiming that the plebian do not exist until 550 bce... and only when the comitia tributa was created. then i strongly disagree on that matters. _____________________________________________________________ No , I don't . But actualy the Plebeian movement started only in the 490' ! the Plebeian movement started on 490 was an act of legal grievances... to re-gain some power and function they have since the beginning. because the comitia centuriata usurped the exclusive and sole fucntion they use to have. to conferred the imperium to the new king to make him legal and not a 'de facto' king or tyrant. tyrant is existing only by the effect of un-opposed military superiority of the centuriata or legio. hope we can 'peruse' your book references to clear the matter. Edited January 6, 2007 by roman wargamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman wargamer Posted January 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 which comitia ; [ curiata , or centuriata ] should be read 'which comitia [ curiata , or centuriata ] really represent the people. ( who are the real people of Rome, when they happen to a confederation of 12 tribes ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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