After the fall of costantinople

[Spartan156]

Ok what i want to know is who captured Constantinople and ended the byzantine Empire? I origionally thought it wasthe turks. Then recent readings said that the crusaders in the 4th crusade did it. So who captured Constantinople and ended the empire. Second question: What happened in Greece after the fall of the capitol?

[Gaius Octavius]

First the Crusaders in the 12th(?) century. Got themselves kicked out. Then the Turks captured it.

 

The City fell to Mehmed II Fatih two and one half hours after dawn on Tuesday, May 29, 6961* (1453 A.D.).

 

The Queen of Cities lasted 1,143 years, 10 months and 4 days.

 

Constatine XI Dragazes Palaeologus probably was killed defending the St. Romanus Gate. His body has never found.

 

* Years from the Beginning of the World.

 

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The people of Constantinople considered themselves, and were, Romans - Romanoi, not Greeks.

 

As for your second question, my memory is shaky. There was a Despot, Thomas(?), and another John(?)who held small chunks of land. The Empire of Trabazond (located on the southerly shore of the Black Sea in Turkey near Georgia), survived for a while, with the indulgence of the sultan and probably a little help from Venice and Genoa. One of my besotted brain cells tells me that it may have lasted (technically) until about 1750 A.D.

 

Many of the educated Romans fled to Florence and other parts of Italy and were employed by the local aristocrats. They were (perhaps) the major impetus for the Renaissance. The Imperial Family is said to have fled to London and presently there is a supposed 'heir' to the Empire living there.

Edited December 24, 2006 by Gaius Octavius

[Divi Filius]

The people of Constantinople considered themselves, and were, Romans - Romanoi, not Greeks.

 

The term hellene started to reappear more and more in the days of the later empire. Ana commented on how she was proud of her "hellenic heritage" but it was used as something connoting legacy then. Their identity was 'Roman'. However as the Byzantine Empire shrunk more and more and as it became pretty much only Greek populated the word "hellene" began to reappear as something connoting identity.

[Honorius]

the Ottomans ended the Byzantine Empire. But the crusaders in 1204 and their sack of the city had a major impact upon the empire. It split it up into 3 minor Byzantine kingdoms eg Empire of Nicea, Despotate of Epirus and the Empire of Trebizond. There were also many latin duchies and 'empires' set up like the Duchy of Athens, Empire of Thessaloniki and so on. This allowed the Ottomans to 'divide and conquer'..and ultimately secured their rise to power.

 

After the fall of Constantinople Greece was largely under the rule of the Ottoman Sultans. But as Gaius already said the brothers John and Thomas Paleologos ruled jointly in the Morea (southern greece..lacadaemon/sparta/argos). And the Venetians still had a large power base in the Aegean and Greece (Negroponte/Euboea) there were still minor duchies and kingdoms but as usual they didnt unite against a common cause and continued to squabble amongst themselves.

 

most of the Byzantine Nobles that escaped the aftermath of the siege in 1453 headed west.. and started of the Renaissance.. there was even a Byzantine community in Venice.. the city that instigated the sack of the city in 1204! Led by the daughter of the last Megas Dux. Anna Notara.

[Segestan]

The Fall of the Greek Empire was the doings of Mohammed II; following the advice of his father , determined to reduce Constantinople . An Army of 260,000 men, aided by a fleet of 300 sail, appeared before the imperial city, which was besieged for the twenty-ninth time since its foundation. After two months the Greek empire was terminated by the fall of the Capital, and its subjects were scattered as slaves over the Ottoman empire. In 1448 , the throne was occupied for the last time by one of its native sovereigns , Constantine Paleologus. The emperor , having in vain implored the assistance of the Latin Princes of Europe , was left with only 7000 or 8000 men to contend against a victorious rival at the head of an Army of 260000 men. Fourteen batteries, mounting guns of enormous calibre, poured destruction of fire , night and day, against the ancient walls. The Christians of Constantinople spent the whole night of May 28th to prayer while the besieging camp was already filled with the shouts of Victory. At day break , the city was violently attacked on all sides; the valour of the Christians long rendered the event doubtful , and the fortune of that day might have been different , but for the retreat of Justiniani, the Genoses commander and his auxiliaries. Various means were used to recall to the deserted city those inhabitants who had fled , but it was long before they returned in any considerable number, although perfect toleration of their religion was granted. Being now master of the metropolis , the sultan claimed the island of Rhodes, occupied by the Knights of Saint John. The demand by the Sultan for tribute was haughtily rejected; and important affairs soon called his attention to another quarter. Pope Calixtus III , was laboring to unite the selfish and impolitic princes of the West in an offensive treaty against the Ottomans. Mohammed II , unwilling to be surprised, marched to lay siege to Belgrade, at the head of 150,000 men , while 200 small vessels blockaded it on the side of the Danube, 1456.

Here the Sultan was less fortunate than he had been at Constantinople; for he was defeated by Huniades, who happily perished in the very hour of triumph. But this check to his arms only turned them in another direction; and the Ducy of athens , possessed since 1364 by the Florentine House of Acciaiuoli was destroyed , as was the independence of Trebizond, Servia, and Bosnia, not long afterwards.The Venetians alone made any important resistance after the reduction of Albania, and their devastating incursions on the seacoasts of Greece gave rise to the solemn vow of Mohammed II ; offered up in all the Mosques in his dominions , pledging himselfand his subjects to the entire extirpation of Christianity, 1469. The very next year , in fact, a powerful Turkish fleet , the largest armaments that had appeared in those seas since the time of Xerxes, attacked the island of Negropont , and massacred all the inhabitants of its capital.

 

 

read; Hallmans Middle Ages.

 

 

 

regards,

[Gaius Octavius]

Byzantium was the name of the town on which Constantine built the Queen of Cities. It was western European commentators who coined the terms 'Byzantine' and 'Byzantium' when referring to the Eastern part of the Roman Empire.

 

Personally, I feel that the Forum should not distinguish (and thus encourage the use of these terms) between East and West with these terms. The laws of both parts applied to each part.

 

How did each part refer to the other in their times? Or, did they distinguish at all?

 

I feel that the adjective has gained currency and may be used as such, i.e., 'the Byzantine Chinese government'; but the noun should only be used when referring to the original town.

[Gaius Octavius]

Oddly enough, the Turks referred to their territory as 'Rum', i.e., Rome. They in their turn considered themselves successors to the Roman Empire (not the mis-named Greek or Byzantine Empire).

 

The mouth of the ________ was secured by a chain (two?). The sultan circumvented the chain by having the ships that appeared on the northerly side of the City dragged over the land north of the ______.

 

The cannon referred to above were first offered (for sale) to Constantine by a Hungarian. Constantine refused, and the Hungarian then sold them to the sultan.

 

I believe that their were Christian troopers in the sultan's army.

 

After the City was taken, the sultan rode into Sancta Sophia on a white horse and despoiled the Church.

[Divi Filius]

I feel that the adjective has gained currency and may be used as such, i.e., 'the Byzantine Chinese government'; but the noun should only be used when referring to the original town.

 

There is little a person can do about it anymore. The term will not change anytime soon so I just adhere to it. The name "Byzantine" in reference to the Eastern Roman Empire is pretty much universal. I remember when I visited a museum of the said empire in Corfu a long while back and was rather surprised at the fact that even Greeks themselves adhere to the name.

[Honorius]

I much prefer using the term 'Byzantine' to me.. it just has a nice sound to it... and is kind off exotic.. plus its much easier to distinguish the change from a roman state to a more greek state.

 

The Golden horn was the inlet of water that was protected by a chain which was connected to the suburb of Galata by which time was in control of the Genoese and was ruled by a 'Podesta'.

 

The Hungarian was called Urban (Orban) he offered his services to the Emperor but at to high a price. The Emperor had no choice but to decline hes wares.

 

There were a vast number of Christians who made up the army. mostly the irregulars.. i think they were called Bashi-bookers or something along those lines. One of the leading generals of the Ottoman army was a Greek christian renegade Zaganos Pasha who converted to Islam and implored the Sultan to continue the siege at a time when morale was at an all time low in the camp of the besiegers.

 

How do u mean he despoiled it?

 

he had a soldier executed when he was trying to remove the tiles from the floor of the grand Cathedral.

 

edit:Spelling.

Edited December 24, 2006 by Honorius

[Gaius Octavius]

How do u mean he despoiled it?

 

he had a soldier executed when he was trying to remove the tiles from the floor of the grand Cathedral.

 

edit:Spelling.

Thanks for filling in the gaps.

The sultan rode into the Church and :horse: .

[Honorius]

nice emote!! atleast he punished the horse

 

but thats a good point in all seriousness..forgot to mention all the people killed in the church.. eg old and frail and the young.

[Gaius Octavius]

nice emote!! atleast he punished the horse

 

but thats a good point in all seriousness..forgot to mention all the people killed in the church.. eg old and frail and the young.

 

...who took sanctuary there.

[Honorius]

nice emote!! atleast he punished the horse

 

but thats a good point in all seriousness..forgot to mention all the people killed in the church.. eg old and frail and the young.

 

...who took sanctuary there.

 

mhm..and the women where tied up around their necks with their own scarfs.

[Tobias]

What happened in Greece after the fall of the capitol?

 

The few remaining Byzantine states were mopped up by the Turks after a while: Morea went in 1460 and Trebizond in 1461. However, Byzantine culture persisted in the southern Balkans and on the coasts of Anatolia, where many of the people continued to call themselves Romans (Rhomaioi) well into the 20th century. As Honorius said, the exodus of the Byzantine elite from the Morea to Italy did much to boost the Renaissance of Classical learning there.

 

To this day, the Patriarch continues to reside in Constantinople, a figurehead for Orthodox Christians all over the world.

 

Morea and the lands to its north was the part of Greece that first regained independence from the Ottomans, in 1830. The modern frontiers of Greece were defined after the First World War, when the Ottoman Empire came to an end. But Constantinople, now Istanbul, is still firmly in the hands of the Turkish state. Without it, modern Greece is inevitably seen as the successor to ancient Greece, not (as it is culturally) to the last Roman Empire.

[FLavius Valerius Constantinus]

I still prefer the terms: Romans (Ρωμαίοι) and Romioi (Ρωμιοί), its so much more meaningful/accurate to me. Even the terms Romania, Rum(-eli), Γραικος(-οι), Ιωνες, and Yunan work.

The term Βυζαντινοι is just(originally) a term that coined no such existing people.

Edited December 27, 2006 by FLavius Valerius Constantinus