Northern Neil Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 Is it a fault that the US is the leader in science, medicine, pharmaceuticals, space, engineering, agriculture, music, consumer products, etc.? ...but not motorcycles, eh? Steve Mcqueen winning desert races on a Triumph? MPC would call that 'Creeping Briticisation'!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiceroD Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 (edited) In Europe, we have a tradition of criticising our polititians, and those of our neighbours. It doesnt mean we hate our country, or any other. We are just giving a counter argument, as defined by the principles of democracy. It is laudable that USA pressured Britain to dismantle its colonial empires. But forgive me for pointing out that the Midwest was acquired when we acquired bits of Africa, yet we do not see it being given back to the Indians. We thank the US for feeding us after WWII - yet we prosecuted that war for 2 years before you came in, buying vast amounts of war supplies from you at the same time. Which we have just finished paying for. Long have I thought Northern Neil about what weve done to the Indians, and it was really really wrong. It always brings we Yanks down a notch to think that every mile of the country represents dead or cheated Indians. (Anyone who has seen Dances with Wolves would agree with me) You are right to compare it to the Age of Imperialism. It was the same Racist thinking in action. "they're just savages" idea I think that the difference is there are relatively few Native Americans left (There isnt a single reservation in my home state of Pennsylvania). Whereas British settlers never displaced the populations of Rhodesia and India. Sure Victorian technology allowed western powers to exploit them but the dieseases of the tropics precluded replacing them. Giving up the Midwest to the Native Americans would be similar to a campaign to "Give Britain back to Britons" so all you Anglo-Saxons get out and let the Welsh have it. Of course like all analogies this is massively simplistic. There is a HUGE difference in time of ownership. But it makes one wonder. Edited February 4, 2007 by CiceroD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Neil Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 (edited) That was a very sober response Cicero and I thank you for it. I accept fully what you mean about the Indians and in fact realised this prior to writing; What I think I was trying to tell my friends was that there is always two ways of looking at things, and used this as an example. But also, I was trying to say that to take a differing view to one held by many Americans does not, and should not, imply a hatred of America. We Brits have done a lot of bad things throughout history, and continue to have a dubious role in the Middle East. The French have never forgiven us for scuttling their navy in 1940, and we still have an immense case to answer in Ireland. Many of my friends from all these places, and others, have pointed these things out - often over a glass of wine, and with a smile afterwards. I actually think America is great, and if your forum meeting was on the east coast, would even consider asking if I could attend, and take in New York at the same time! Edited February 5, 2007 by Northern Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 Is it a fault that the US is the leader in science, medicine, pharmaceuticals, space, engineering, agriculture, music, consumer products, etc.? This is a lost cause, man, if you really think you are the best in all this matters for sure you are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 N.N., who won the bloody race? Basil Fawlty? Capt. Peacock? Baldrick? As for American Indians, you imperialists started the slaughter with your syphilis and blunderbusses. You colonialists didn't make slaves and peons of your colonials? WWII. It's about time you Brits paid us off! We're still paying for it. Had you all given Germany a few more acres of China and Africa before WWI, it might not have happened. Had you been a little easier on the Germans after WWI, the sequence, WWII, might not have happened. Had you all kept your noses out of the Middle East, maybe there wouldn't be all the present problems. Stay away from the Moon! When we go to the E.U., why are we forced to tip some obnoxious waiter? Why are we singled out for cheating (Spain and Portugal of the late 60's and early 70's excluded.)? :bash: As I have quoted once before: Little Indian, Sioux or Crow; Little Turk or Japanee; Little Tattle Tale :wub: and Northern Neil, Oh, don't you wish that you were me! :tank: :usaflag: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 I can envision the inscrutable, obscure and translucent mind of My Lord of the Brigantines :notworthy: , partaking of this japeness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traianus Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 (edited) Is it a fault that the US is the leader in science, medicine, pharmaceuticals, space, engineering, agriculture, music, consumer products, etc.? This is a lost cause, man, if you really think you are the best in all this matters for sure you are Edited February 4, 2007 by Traianus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 Yes, that would be the reason, but you are giving me the reason, there was a poor application of resources because US didn't have resources oh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 Are you saying the US isn't? You need a lesson in economics. No one 'thinks' it Traianus, it is fact that the US is a leader in those fields. But...where do you see the specific word "economy" in what I said?of course you have probably the best economy in the world, but engineering, mecidine, science, agriculture( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traianus Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 (edited) oh Edited February 5, 2007 by Traianus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nephele Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 I'm talking of a "near future" 2020-2030 when I say all this things. Whee-oh! Nostradamus rides again! :horse: -- Nephele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 ...but I've been living in France Why is that not a shock? I finish here, the truth is that america doesn't matter me at all... Sounds like facts and figures matter less. ...and the "uncultured Spain" Culture and education are not the same thing and you haven't shown much of the second (let's hope you can paint or sing). Please, don't get angry by this stupid things, I'd like to assume that you are more clever than this patriotic argues Not at all. I'm not a blind patriot, but if you--a foreigner--are going to make attacks on the US with insults and poor research of facts then we reserve the right to jab back. Don't whine or equivocate like a Frenchman when the jabs hit their target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 and if your forum meeting was on the east coast, would even consider asking if I could attend, and take in New York at the same time! If the meeting ever happens, I am sure you and any one else so inclined would be welcome to join us. This is getting silly. One of the Tyrants is going to consign this to sub-Tartarus, and pick me out for a 'moderate' thrashing. I find these perennial America vs Europe threads a bit silly, as I am sure we would rather live with each other than under the dominion of Sino-fascism or Islamo-fascism. Since I am not exactly objective, I have asked the other mods to look and see if any lines are being crossed. Personally I do feel the thread has outlived reasonable and intelligent discourse. The only thing that remains is to compare GWB to Hitler. (There isnt a single reservation in my home state of Pennsylvania). No, but we have plenty of Quakers. And Amish. And Mennonites. And under-educated, hygiene free rednecks who might as well just be home in Alabama. It's a beautiful mosaic of socio-religious diversity. Or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 ...Since I am not exactly objective, I have asked the other mods to look and see if any lines are being crossed. Personally I do feel the thread has outlived reasonable and intelligent discourse. The only thing that remains is to compare GWB to Hitler... And there I was having fun gettin' my trailer-park 'merican on and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 (edited) Traianus, don't worry about 2030-2040, I have it from reliable sources that the world will end in 2012. GWB to AH? Nah, Mortimer McSnurd. Edited February 5, 2007 by Gaius Octavius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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