Tobias Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 Same with mine, he was on the Kokoda trail as a communications officer, and he would never say anything beyond the fact that he saw the Japanese of that time as the ultimate of barbarians. I'm not saying that's the case today though (gotta be careful, the politically correct lot are everywhere these days lol), just that the Japanese certainly weren't exactly sticklers for the Geneva Convention then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 German and Italian POW's I can understand Italian POWs but I can't imagine German POWs. They look exactly like normal Americans. Actually German now is the most common nationality in America. Italians don't look like 'normal' Americans??? My dear fellow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted June 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 German and Italian POW's I can understand Italian POWs but I can't imagine German POWs. They look exactly like normal Americans. Actually German now is the most common nationality in America. Italians don't look like 'normal' Americans??? My dear fellow! Yeah I saw that as well. Pretty funny, I guess we look like 'abnormal' Americans! The irony is that in 1940's America full-blooded Italians made up a substantially higher percentage of the population than they do today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) "Fighting for Spain" - The reviews for this book seem to point to it being a piece of assidous scholarship, and as one reviwr I read earlier this morning says , this is a war where the losing side made most of the comment. A further pointer is that both sides were a shambles of mutually suspicious groups, as the Nationalists were less of a shambles they overcame the chaotic agglomeration of the Republicans . http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...2620765-5794332 If you require a vivid, breathing portrait of the conflict in a digestible and very readable book try this http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...2620765-5794332 it couls realisticaly be subtitled "the death of idealism" Edited June 9, 2006 by Pertinax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 The worst crimes of the allies were made by the soviets. Millions of people, even from allied nations were killed by executions, starvation and cold in Russia. For example when Romania changed sides many soldiers, some 150.000, were arested and send to Siberia. Few of them returned in the late 50's. Not to mention Katyn. This is why most romanians of the WW2 generation had a high regard for the Wermacht and deep hatred and fear for the Red Army. Even cehs and poles are guilty of crimes when they forced millions of german civilians in to exile killing many of them. Everybody was guilty. Nobody was innocent except the powerles. War it's like that. All wars had crimes and cruelties. All wars will keep having them. Of course, it's big difference between mass murder and an isolated act of violence. Going back to the POW's of the japonese many died because of starvation and sickness, but many japones soldiers had the same problems.At a point in the war, in some areas, the japonese were not able anymore to feed and treat the POW's. The claims of the chinese and correans look for me like power games by trying to use the war crimes as a poltical toll in today's confrontations. Remeber the apologies thread Nobody should apologise, but for his own personal deeds! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 Kosmo: Your point about the Soviets is well taken. Unfortunately, you seem to exculpate the Japanese from blame for their war crimes. It was Japanese Army POLICY to treat Chinese, Koreans and POW's as subhumans. Because the Soviets commited atrocities, does not relieve the Japanese of responsibility for their actions. Whatever reasons that may be imputed for the recent Korean and Chinese efforts, do not in any way obviate the facts of the Japanese atrocities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Germanicus Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 Having travelled to South Korea for work in the past, their hatred for the Japanese is certainly undiminished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spurius Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 (edited) Until she died, my mother never fully trusted anyone from Germany. Side effect of having been used as slave labor by the Nazis during WWII. (Yes, she chose not to return to the USSR after the war even though it meant never seeing her family again from the age of 17.) It took until the late 60s for her to really talk with a native German. She even developed a friendship with a woman who was in Germany at the time, but there was always a certain level she would never let it get to. My father, however, didn't have this problem. His view: They're trying to kill me like I'm trying to kill them. If we weren't in uniform and ordered to fight we probably would be having a beer. He hated the higher ups who made policy and decisions but he had no major problem with the common folk. Of course he was a friendly guy who would risk limb or give anything to help another. (I remember times when I gave up gifts to give to enlisted families in his company when they didn't have Christmas gifts for their kids...with the soldier standing at the door on Christmas morning.) The upshot: People are people and how they react varies according to their experience. I think that as a group, the Japanese government has not fostered an honest dialog about WWII. I also think that the war crimes tribunals were cut short for the Japanese. Such is expediency and needs with the Cold War taking up where pre-WWII red scares and military action left off. Edited June 9, 2006 by Spurius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Posted June 12, 2006 Report Share Posted June 12, 2006 I don't deny that the japonese made war crimes, I'm just saying that some of the today's claims are not honest, but nationalist rethorics. And some of the POW casualties are not neccesary their foult, but of war conditions. If this sounds like a denial it is not. In order to accuse somebody truth it's important. For example chinese killed more chinese between 1900 and 1945 that the japonese, but it's better to point at the external enemy than trying to understand why your people killed each other with little thought. Romanians made war crimes on jews and soviet civilians, but the goverment it's paying lip service to that and keeps pointing that romanian jews were the largest group to survive in Axis controlled Europe. Several hundred jews were killed from a population of millions. So the jew population in Romania was largely spared, but the romanian army killed many in Basarabia (today Republic of Moldova) and in Odessa. To find the truth a broader view it's needed. Polish resistance was heroic, but some of this resistance groups while bravely fighting the invaders killed many polish jews runing from the germans. This problem it's very sensitive and as the culprits are dead we should try to distance ourselves a bit and see the broader picture because just putting a moral tag on this actions does not help us to understand what happened. The murders in the 90's in Jugoslavia where neighbour killed neighbour are a grim reminder that this might happen again. This conflict that was daily in front of our eyes it's less understood that WW2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted June 12, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2006 If you require a vivid, breathing portrait of the conflict in a digestible and very readable book try this http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...2620765-5794332 it couls realisticaly be subtitled "the death of idealism" Should've responded earlier but Homage to Catalonia is one of Orwell's great books and one of the best war memoirs ever written I think. Too bad it gets lost in the shadow of 1984 and Animal Farm like his other writings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 (edited) If you require a vivid, breathing portrait of the conflict in a digestible and very readable book try this http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...2620765-5794332 it couls realisticaly be subtitled "the death of idealism" Should've responded earlier but Homage to Catalonia is one of Orwell's great books and one of the best war memoirs ever written I think. Too bad it gets lost in the shadow of 1984 and Animal Farm like his other writings. Im glad you said that as I think it is superior to both . Are you (I assume) familiar also with this title: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...5Fencoding=UTF8 by Laurie Lee from the same conflict . Edited June 14, 2006 by Pertinax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted June 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 If you require a vivid, breathing portrait of the conflict in a digestible and very readable book try this http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...2620765-5794332 it couls realisticaly be subtitled "the death of idealism" Should've responded earlier but Homage to Catalonia is one of Orwell's great books and one of the best war memoirs ever written I think. Too bad it gets lost in the shadow of 1984 and Animal Farm like his other writings. Im glad you said that as I think it is superior to both . Are you (I assume) familiar also with this title: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...5Fencoding=UTF8 by Laurie Lee from the same conflict . I have a copy lying in my storage shed. Great book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spurius Posted June 15, 2006 Report Share Posted June 15, 2006 Never read "A Moment of War", but I'll get my hands on a copy. Thanks for the tip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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