Time - Keeping Things In Perspective

[Viggen]

Just a reminder;

 

People tend to go through history without realising how much time between periods went by...

 

for example, US Declaration of Independence was in 1776 that was only 230 years ago...

 

Now Rome was "founded" in 753 BC, add 230 years and we are "only" in 523 BC (The rape of Lucretia hasnt even happend yet), or another example the Punic Wars, they started around 264 BC add 230 years and you are in 34 BC, (War between Antony and Octavian)...

 

just thought it might be noteworthy to remember when talking about the roman empire how long it actually lasted...

 

cheers

viggen

[Pertinax]

only around 525 years till Pompeii goes up in smoke! and only another 675 years till Hadrian builds the Wall!

 

and two millenia till the Eastern Empire falls..

Edited March 3, 2006 by Pertinax

[Primus Pilus]

only around 525 years till Pompeii goes up in smoke! and only another 675 years till Hadrian builds the Wall!

 

and two millenia till the Eastern Empire falls..

 

I agree completely with the concept but we might have to start a little earlier than 1776 to compare appropriately. If the mythical founding of Rome was 753 BC, than this should be compared to what?.. maybe the settlement of Jamestown in Virginia colony or Plymouth in the Massachussetts colony in the late 16th early 17th centuries. The year 1776 and the 'expulsion of King George' might be more comparable to the founding of the Roman Republic in 510 BC and the expulsion of the Tarquins, so the development of the USA is considerably older than the nation itself.

 

Regardless, I am not trying to compare the two, just adding a little additional perspective on the time frame there. Unfortunately on average I think people look at Rome only in the context of it as an Empire, and completely dismiss the incredible length of time that it dominated its locality, region, before it came to dominate the western world. Just consider that the control of the Mediterranean that came with the Punic Wars and truly established Rome as a territorial empire was a full 2 centuries before the change in government.

 

Interesting stuff really. Makes me wonder if Romans as individuals truly understood the incredible length of time in which they dominated the western world.

[caldrail]

I suppose we ought really to extend Rome via the Byzantines up to 1458AD. If that was todays date, the Rome begins around the actual time of the Punic Wars!

[roman wargamer]

People tend to go through history without realising how much time between periods went by... Viggen

 

it is natural err and misunderstanding for none professional educators, like me, who are passive.

 

in "Nataniel's Nuts" book i read few years ago,

it claim that the war between England and Dutch in the Far East , Indonesia, about the nuts.

 

when the English get the America from Dutch. The Dutch exchange it for the right in Bull Run.

 

a very tiny island in the very south of Indonesia but very rich in nuts, who happen to grow only there.

 

i can not even recall the proper chronological time frame in a year by year or by 20 years frame.

 

the only things i commonly remember, time frame of the great events, the cause and effects.

 

so correction should be emphasize to correct those impression.

 

as i can easily remember in the history of Rome.

 

The rape of Lucretia was the cause for the over throw of Etruscan king and the republic was born.

 

The Punic Wars 1 and 2 was mostly the story of Rome and Scipio clan and Hannibal clan.

 

The power struggle for the control of Rome senate causes many civil war and the Imperator was born.

and J. Caesar was the most well know personality it produce even after 2 millinnia.

 

that's how normally common people know it, sometimes without realising that a great span of time

separate the two event's that runs runs for many generation time and even decades or centuries.

 

but it is not enough reason to most dedicated people who loves Rome very well.

because it could sometime distort facts of event no.1 to event no.2 who have great different span time.

[Caius Maxentius]

I wonder how differently the Romans perceived historical time, in comparison to us?

 

We've seen sweeping changes in technology and lifestyle in the past few generations. My grandparents remember a time before planes and before cars were common. Go back 300 years from our time, and technology is much more primitive, and social organization is quite different.

 

In contrast, if a Roman of Trajan's time were to think back to the time of the Scipios, the technology wouldn't seem that different. The government had changed, and the territorial extent of the empire had changed, but would the Roman of the 2nd century AD see the Punic War era as more primitive/less developed, or just older? Would that 300 year span seem as historically remote to him as a 300 year span seems to us?

[caldrail]

Yes I think it would.

[Primus Pilus]

Would that 300 year span seem as historically remote to him as a 300 year span seems to us?

 

Hmm yes, it would seem remote due to the simple passage of time, but the great bulk of general daily life functions was about the same. There are the obvious changes in political environment and the inclusion of more 'provincials', but to a common person in Rome, his life wouldn't have been as different as the comparable modern age.

 

Just think, even in the last 100 or so modern years we've seen the addition of the automobile, the airplane and the jet, penicillin and immeasurable advances in medicine (both pharmaceutical and surgical), the telephone, harnessed electricity in every day use in the home, the radio, television, nuclear power, the internet, and the list goes on and on. By comparison, between the Punic Wars and Trajan, other than laying more roads, running water throughout the conquered lands of the empire and building some massive/impressive buildings and/or monuments, not much changed as far as actual technology. Transportation, medicine, entertainment, communication and even basic clothing remained unchanged (though styles did fluctuate over the years, people were still wearing the same types of clothing).

[Ulpii]

I agree with this idea that Romans may well have compressed time. The famous adage: felicior Augusto, melior Traiano, may he be more fortunate than Augustus and better than Trajan, shows how easy it was for them to associate men seperated by a period of almost a century and then to take that association and use it into the later Roman Empire. Of course this could be caused in part by the Roman dating. To say, "in the Consulships of Gaius Sulpicius Galba and Decimus Haterius Agrippa", to A Roman in AD 122, would surely not be as illuminating as to say, "in AD22".