FLavius Valerius Constantinus Posted January 27, 2006 Report Share Posted January 27, 2006 Lets see what my dictionary gives: far, -is, n. ador, -is, n. alicastrum, -i, n. (early ripening variety of emmer; summer spelt) farreus, -a -um (the adjective form) For beer: cervesa, -ae, f. (regular beer) cervesiola, -ae, f. (light beer) bracio, braciare, braciavi, braciatus (verb- to brew) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted January 29, 2006 Report Share Posted January 29, 2006 And, certainly, Roman soldiers -- when they were far away from Italy and Greece -- drank the stuff in gallons. How do we know that they were drinking the beer? Couldn't they have been using it to bake bread instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted January 30, 2006 Report Share Posted January 30, 2006 just a quick note before I go to Glannaventa -Pantagathus recommended "Sacred and Herbal Healing Beers " by Buhner to me-what a find! check this title out if you have any interest in beer/herbal medicine/ religious healing/pagan religion-they all converge in this work. Â Well done Pantagathus! :angel: Â Pantagathus splendidus est! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pantagathus Posted January 30, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2006 Pantagathus splendidus est! Â Thank you greatly sir... As discussed, I knew you would find the book appealing (to say the least!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 1, 2006 Report Share Posted February 1, 2006 This book is even more important than my initial glee would have you believe, the introduction is one of the most effective de-bunking essays on "modernism /scientific reductionism" I have ever read . I am still wandering through its pages, whilst its links to Rome are not exceptional its mind set in interpretation of historical ideas in relation to the "idea of progress" is excellent, what I suggest is that I will offer a review on (perhaps most fittingly) a pagan/polytheist web site and link back to this thread. Many forum members would , I feel , be interested in its startlingly non-pc language and its admiration of ancient technologies and the psychological and spiritual strengths of ancient societies in relation to anomic "modernism". ...and thats just a book about beer and plants! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pantagathus Posted February 1, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2006 Perhaps cover it in a Blog entry? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 (edited) I will cover this item in the Blog, but I have a lot of reading to do yet. As an aside on Pictish brewing (of heather and heather honey)I was very interested to note that the Picts used the whole hive in the process of fermentation, comb, honey , propolis, angry bees, pollen, grubs.No wonder this was so high in protein as a foodstuff -and of such repute as a medicine.They also included the "fogg" deposit from the heather flowers that clings to them in the Scottish climate, this final addition would ensure a possible hallucogenic component to the mix.I understand that although several Erica species flourish in N America the "fogg" is unknown. A side note in the text refers to the Roman's great desire to get hold of quality local beer from the Pictii. No wonder. Edited February 2, 2006 by Pertinax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pantagathus Posted February 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 I will cover this item in the Blog, but I have a lot of reading to do yet. Â Oh my, I think I must bite the bullet and go ahead and order a copy. The backlog of books in queue might have to get used to their status! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 I will cover this item in the Blog, but I have a lot of reading to do yet. Â Oh my, I think I must bite the bullet and go ahead and order a copy. The backlog of books in queue might have to get used to their status! Â Im moving steadily into the text -but this is a dense work-Buhner's technical herbal and chemical knowledge is vast (never mind the recipes).I hope no one rushes out and tries Henbane Beer as a first attempt- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Dalby Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 And, certainly, Roman soldiers -- when they were far away from Italy and Greece -- drank the stuff in gallons. How do we know that they were drinking the beer? Couldn't they have been using it to bake bread instead? Â Fair question -- always question assumptions -- but no, that doesn't work as an explanation, I don't think, because Romans in the north could have made bread in the same way that it was made all over the Roman world. So why go to the fag of making beer, as part of that process, in the outlying provinces only? Â No, they must have wanted beer because it was hard work or expensive getting supplies of bulk wine far to the north and east of where wine was currently being made. It was less effort, and still produced the requisite level of happiness in the troops, if (except on special days) you gave them the kind of alcohol that could be made locally. Â Â Lacertus is seeking information on Borage as a beer in relation to Celtic culture, I am up to my neck in photo editing at present-and my "sacred beers" has still not arrived! I will take up this post in a day or two but if Pantagathus or AD have quick references or links please post here chaps! Â I have only heard of it as an additive -- in wine, punch, etc. Plutarch, somewhere, says that bugloss (similar to borage) is added to wine 'to increase the gaiety of the participants'. Not sure if that helps ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 2, 2006 Report Share Posted February 2, 2006 (edited) I have some more info now on the Borage as a beer- firstly " syrup made of the flowers of Borage comferteth the heart, purgins melancholy and quieteth phreneticke and lunaticke person" Gerarde 1597. Â Ok the herb is mucilaginous,expectorant, diaphoretic ,tonic and calmative, antidepressant and anti-inflammatory.It is especially useful after severe and prolonged stress.The leaves, flowers and seeds are abundant with a high concentration of Gamma Linoleic Acid ( so you would nowadays use to reduce prostatic swelling and to deal with dense breast tissue, and for endemetriosis ). Its usage was as a pre-combat tonic/intoxicant as an additive to heather mead (with the most significant "fogg" fungal nerve agent ( a fine powdery lichen like growth) gathered with the heather flowers). Heather itself being in some species narcotic .So, one would slap on the malachite/woad ready use wound dressing ,get tanked up on beer and leap onto the yoke pole of your chariot! Hopefully you harvested the Borage in spring when it was lusty and full of sap otherwise you might not fancy fighting anyone. Â ps its full of magnesium as well -a strong nervine, so full in fact that the dried herb makes a nice little firework display!The alkoloids are present only in small quantities-but , the fresh herb has a greater concentration and I suggest the GLA gets these into circulation (literally) quite fast.Not a few modern patients are unable to take the oil as they find an unpleasant increase in blood presure occurs. Â In Hibernia, Medb of Connacht would be invoked to give courage to the warrior ,with Borage as an offering Edited February 2, 2006 by Pertinax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted February 3, 2006 Report Share Posted February 3, 2006 How do we know that they were drinking the beer? Couldn't they have been using it to bake bread instead?Fair question -- always question assumptions -- but no, that doesn't work as an explanation, I don't think, because Romans in the north could have made bread in the same way that it was made all over the Roman world. So why go to the fag of making beer, as part of that process, in the outlying provinces only? Â Maybe in the outlying provinces, where soldiers were on garrison duty, individual soldiers had to make their own bread, but to get the bread to rise, they had to use yeast, which was too difficult for individual soldiers to keep active. Therefore, soldiers lit upon the solution of using the local yokels' smelly alcoholic beverage (glorious beer to us barbarians) for baking bread, and thus great quantities of the stuff were kept on hand for soldiers on the frontier. Also, maybe (in a pinch) they drank some too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Dalby Posted February 3, 2006 Report Share Posted February 3, 2006 How do we know that they were drinking the beer? Couldn't they have been using it to bake bread instead?Fair question -- always question assumptions -- but no, that doesn't work as an explanation, I don't think, because Romans in the north could have made bread in the same way that it was made all over the Roman world. So why go to the fag of making beer, as part of that process, in the outlying provinces only? Â Maybe in the outlying provinces, where soldiers were on garrison duty, individual soldiers had to make their own bread, but to get the bread to rise, they had to use yeast, which was too difficult for individual soldiers to keep active. Therefore, soldiers lit upon the solution of using the local yokels' smelly alcoholic beverage (glorious beer to us barbarians) for baking bread, and thus great quantities of the stuff were kept on hand for soldiers on the frontier. Also, maybe (in a pinch) they drank some too. Â I don't think there's much disagreement between us! Whether you drink the beer, or pour it into your bread dough, might depend on your state of mind ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 5, 2006 Report Share Posted February 5, 2006 (edited) I will be reviewing Bruhner's "Sacred Herbal and Healing Beers " in my blog-as it is not strictly relevant directly to Rome -but has a lot of useful ideas on how to look at the idea of "cultures" and how we try to percieve them from a constant "modern" perspective.The work is also very close to my own specialisation. Bruhner suggests quite simply that bread making and "beer" making were utterly intertwined , literaly feeding off each other for living yeasts, and both products had high deliverable calorific contents for ancient peoples. This isnt the place to open the review further-but there are some great recipes and startling additives ! Â ps: if what im taking notes of at present is correct ( use of Achillea Millefolium in a heather (Ericiae) Mead ) then if I was on Hadrian's Wall with the Bataviian Cohort id want to try a few shots on a gloomy night. Edited February 5, 2006 by Pertinax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Ok the first part of the review is in the blog if members care to view it, from there it will grow and progress to a full analysis ( including non-european items) off site at Pantagathus's Nectar of the Gods! site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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