Byzantine's Nero?

[Emperor Goblinus]

Did the Byzantine Empire have an emperor that measured up to someone like Nero in terms of sheer cruelty, perversity, and insanity?

[Philhellene]

Constantine V Iconoclast - he was persecuting orthodoxes anh he killed a lot of them (they called him "Mamona").

[Neos Dionysos]

Constantine V Iconoclast - he was persecuting orthodoxes anh he killed a lot of them (they called him "Mamona").

 

 

No, he persecuted Iconophiles, they were all Orthodox at this time just different sects. Constatine V Copronymus, (meaning the 'Dung-named' because it was said during his baptism he deficated), continued the policy of Iconoclasm from his father Leo III and was of the beleif that it was heretical to venerate images of Jesus and Mary since to him and his supporters it seemed as though people were worshiping that actual imagne, rather than the person on the image. Leo IV, his son, was married to an Athenian named Irene who would become one of the most famous of Byzantine Empresses and is now a saint in the Orthodox church because while her husband, like Constatine V and Leo III his father and grand-father, was Iconoclast he was moderate towards them but soon enacted very harsh punishments after Constantine V's death and when it was discovered that Irene had Icons in her private bed chamber hidden she quickly lost favor and was no longer visited by Leo IV. He died shortly afterward though in battle and many quickly said it was divine retribution from god and Irene, acting as regent for her baby son Constantine VI, was crowned Empress and ruled for quite a while and brought Iconoclasm to an end.

[Emperor Goblinus]

Interesting. I know very little about the Byzantine emperors, and will have to do more reading.

[Neos Dionysos]

Interesting. I know very little about the Byzantine emperors, and will have to do more reading.

 

 

Eastern Roman/Byzantine history is very fascinating indeed. I highly suggest you pick up John Julius Norwich's trilogy "Byzantium" hardcover books, book 1 "The Early Centuries", book 2 "The Apogee", and book 3 "The Decline and Fall". If this is too much you can get a condensed version of the three in "A Short History of Byzantium". It is not as long but a lot of facts hit you at once so be prepared but it is an excellent lead and a good start for those who are new to subject because it is not some dry read but made enjoyable.

[Emperor Goblinus]

Thanks. I'll definitely check my college library to see if they have them. I do know that they have volumes and volumes on Byzantium.

[Tobias]

I have "A short history of Byzantium" and would recommend it to anyone with a budding interest in teh history of the Byzantines.

Hmm, A Byzantine Nero. There have been many emperors with features of Nero; Basil II was named "Bulgaroktonos" (The Bulgar-Slayer) after he was said to have blinded 99 of every 100 prisoners out of around 14 000 prisoners from the Battle of Kleidon against the Bulgars, and the rest were blinded in one eye so they could lead their comrades home

The difference between Basil II and Nero is that Basil was an extremely efficient general and ruler, and practically rebuilt the Byzantine Empire.

There were many, many others, each with their own interesting ways, however.

Edited December 5, 2005 by Tobias

[Philhellene]

No, he persecuted Iconophiles, they were all Orthodox at this time just different sects.

 

According to victorious Christian doctrine all its historical opponents are not Orthodoxes.

 

Hmm, A Byzantine Nero. There have been many emperors with features of Nero...

 

Basil II was pitiless for ennemies, not for his nationals, like Nero. Constantine V Iconoclast (I prefer do not use Copronymus-Defecator, it`s scoffing name) was the most bloody tyrant. Can anybody proove the contrary?

Edited December 5, 2005 by Philhellene

[Neos Dionysos]

According to victorious Christian doctrine all its historical opponents are not Orthodoxes.

 

Exactly, 'Victorious Christian Doctrine'... as we all know history is written by the victors and filled with propaganda. You need to be careful of this.

[Philhellene]

Exactly, 'Victorious Christian Doctrine'... as we all know history is written by the victors and filled with propaganda.

 

Dispite this we have "Church histoties" of Philostorgius and Zacharias... By the way they called only their followers "Orthodoxes".

[Tobias]

Basil II was pitiless for ennemies, not for his nationals, like Nero.

 

That's fair enough. I was only referring to cruelty in general, but i concede the point

[FLavius Valerius Constantinus]

If I had to decide on a female Nero, it would definitely be Theodora. But I would select Basil II.

[Hamilcar Barca]

I would rank no Byzantine Emperor alongside the madness and cruelty of Nero although there were certanley bad ones. Irene - Constantine VI's mother, desposed of and blinded her own son to take sole rule of the Empire for herself. In 800AD, Charlemenge was named emperor of Rome owing that their was no emperor at the time, as Irene was currenly Empress.

 

Justinian II was by no means mad, but certanley a man who liked sweet revenge and then some. A relatively good ruler in the first part of his reign, he was none-the-less overthrown in 695 by his over ambitious general Leontius, who had his toungue and nose slit before throwing him into exile. Ten years later, having recruited a condiderable ammont of support in the countryside, he returned and snuck into the city via an aquaduct pipe, suprising his ursurper and reclaiming his throne. Leonitius and Tiberius (his successor) and his supporters were beaten black and blue in a pillory for some months before Justinian dragged them through the streets and publicly beheaded them. His revenge didn't stop there though, anyone suspected of enemy sympathies could be incarcerated, tortured or killed. Thousands were killed or mutilated in his paranoia fuelled purges which lasted over 6 years. Eventually a rebellion formed within the army and Justinian II was overthrown again, permanatly. Both he and his six year old son were put to death.

 

Another perhaps worth mentioning would be Basil I; A brutally efficient ruler akin to the most depolarble forms of cruelty and violence of his day. When his general Leo abandoned his post in battle in 867AD, Basil had his right eye burnt out and his right hand amputated. Basil was to the Arabs what his second namesake was to the Bulgarians, only more brutal. In his campaigns against them, thousands of captured muslims were hung, burnt, skinned alive or dismembered to death.

Edited December 6, 2005 by Hamilcar Barca

[Neos Dionysos]

I would rank no Byzantine Emperor alongside the madness and cruelty of Nero although there were certanley bad ones. Irene - Constantine VI's mother, desposed of and blinded her own son to take sole rule of the Empire for herself.

 

 

And she's a saint now. While she was cruel to her son, she still accomplished many things during her regin. The notable one being the re-instatution of the icons and she ruled fairly well, plus it must be remembered that she only did this act to her son when he tried to have her killed and for him to rule alone so you can't blame her for being secure. Because of course she was ruling, the Papacy saw the throne empty in thier eyes because a woman could not rule in her own right to them and so made Charlamnge Emperor as an insult to the East. It is alleged that Irene tried to negotiate a marriage with Charlamagne but this was thwarted and later Constatine VI tried to marry Charlamagne's daughter but this was in turn stopped by Irene. She was eventually conspired against by people she was very gracious and giving to and they placed Nicephorus, whom Irene had raised to his position of power before this, on the throne. She died a year later in exile on Lesbos. Nicephorus wasn't a great ruler then either, it didn't help that he did not honor the treaty Irene made with the Saracens and so forced a war with them and lost badly having to pay a worse endemity. Later when the Saracen king died, he went east to fight the Bulgars who would defeat him and kill him in battle which then the Bulgar king used his hollowed skull as a drinking cup.

Edited December 6, 2005 by Neos Dionysos

[FLavius Valerius Constantinus]

Oh Irene, you sure definitely are another Theodora. I'm interested by the fact that the East and West might have been united if Charlemagne's daughter and Constantine VI married.