Italy In 280 B.C.

[ahowl11 HRTW Mod Leader]

Hello everyone,

 

I am new here at this forum, and I am here to learn about Rome and her history, along with the many other peoples that she encountered throughout her history.

 

The main reason is because I am a mod leader. In case any of you do not know, in short "modding" or modifying is where you change certain aspects of a computer game so that way it is like a different game. I am currently doing that for the game, Rome: Total War.

My goal is to make it as historical as possible as there are many limits to computer games.

 

So I would like to present the situation of Italy in 280 B.C.

 

The Roman Republic was on the rise, they had previously had an encounter with Tarentum and relations became hostile. Tarentum had sent for Pyrrhus of Epirus to come to their aid.

 

Ok, so I know that southern Italy as far as the Cities of Tarentum, Locri, and Croton were still independant but under Pyrrhus' influence.

 

Now, how far south did Rome extend? Did they own Samnite territory such as Beneventum? I know they had Latium and Campania under control, but did they have any territory below Capua? If they didn't were the Samnites still around? I know Rome had defeated them in the Third Samnite War, but were the Samnites still a free people?

 

In the north it's a similar issue for me. Were the Etruscans still around? I know they had been declining for sometime due to the pressure from the various Celtic Tribes. Also I know of many small tribes and city states that could possibly be around. Were the Bruttians, Lucanians, and Messapians around in the south? Were there Aequi, Volsci, and Marsi in central Italy? Did the Umbrians control Ariminum?

 

I know the Veneti owned Patavium, the Ligurians owned Genua, the Insubres owned Mediolanium. What about the Boii? They are interesting. And then we have the Senones, were they around? Finally did the Romans occupy eastern Italy yet? Did they own Ancona, and were the Piceni around?

 

Last question, who was in control of Rhegium? Was it a Greek City or owned by an Italian Tribe?

 

I am just a student wanting to learn, I have always been extremely interested in Ancient Roman History and the peoples she encountered. Also it will help me in making my modification for Rome: Total War.

 

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

[Maty]

"Last question, who was in control of Rhegium? Was it a Greek City or owned by an Italian Tribe?"

 

The situation with Rhegium was rather complicated.

 

 

Fortunately, Dionysus of Halicarnassus can help you here. Here's the news for 280 with regard to the city.

 

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Dionysius_of_Halicarnassus/20*.html#4

 

The short version is that by the end of the year the city was Roman, on account of the Romans having killed everyone else on the premises.

 

And yes, the Etruscans were still about, as the consul Tiberius Corunicanus fought against them, and won a triumph.

 

Good luck with the mod. I've currently got a horde of Slavs besieging Constantinople in RTW Barbarian Invasion. The outcome depends on whether I can get the Huns involved...

[Pompieus]

In general terms, in 280 BC the Roman confederation extended from about the Arno River, across the Appenines to north of Ancona. In the South it crossed the peninsula probably from the Silarus River (north of ancient Paestum) to north of Monte Gargano (the "spur" on the Italian boot). Within this area was actual Roman/Latin territory in Latium and the Liri Valley, "half-citizens" (sine suffragio ) in the Sabine country and Campania (including Capua and Cumae - once Greek cities now ruled by Italic peoples the Greeks called "Oscans"), allied towns (about a dozen in Etruria, plus Greek Naples) and allied Sabellian peoples in the Appenine Mountains viz: Samnites, Marsi, Paeligni, Frentani, Vestini, Marrucini and the non-Italic Picentes. There were also Roman and Latin colonies at strategic spots in the allied areas including outliers such as Luceria and Venusia in Apulia, Sena Gallica north of Ancona and Hadria and Castra Nova on the Adriatic. The Samnites had only recently been defeated in a long exhausting war in 290 and added to the confederation; and a major raid by the Gallic Senones and Boii joined by several Etruscan towns was defeated in 284-280.

 

Outside the Roman alliance the Po valley was peopled by several Gallic tribes (Insubres, Cenomani, Boii, Senones) and the non-Celtic Veneti in Venezia. Liguruans were on the coast around Genoa. In the South there was a league of Brutians in the toe of the boot and the Lucanian League on the instep. In Apulia were the Daunians and in the heel of the boot Messapians (apparently non-Italic speaking peoples). Tarentum headed the Greek Italiot League including Heraclea, Metapontum and sometimes Locri, Croton, Thurii & Rhegium. Many of these Greek cities had suffered lately at the hands of Agathoclese of Syracuse and were threatened by the Brutian & Lucanian highlanders.

 

This is all VERY generalized, somewhat speculative and open to criticism, and does not pretend to be exhaustive. Just an attempt to give a general sense of the political groupings in Italy when Pyrrhus arrived in 280. There were also major goings-on in Sicily at the time.

Edited October 16, 2011 by Pompieus

[ahowl11 HRTW Mod Leader]

Thank you both so much for your help! It is very important that each region from Scotland to India, and Scandinavia to North Africa needs to be covered. It helps with the recruitment of troops and the enemies that face Rome.

 

I wish I could implement all of those tribes into the game, but the hardcoding limits limit the map to how many cities it can have.

 

I will post similar threads like this in the future concerning other regions.

 

Does anyone know the troops that these certain people used in warfare? I know of Tarentine Cavalry but other than that my mind draws a blank. What were some prominent military units used by the tribes and city states of that time in 280 B.C.

 

By the way Maty, good luck on your game! Hordes are tough to beat!

[NoJobRob]

Keep us updated about the mod's progress. Do you have a thread on TWC for it, or a site where we can follow along on the progress? I love Rome: Total War. I bought it back in 2004 and I still play the crap out of it. LOL Can't wait for CA to make R2TW so the modders can make it even more awesome.

[Kosmo]

Thank you both so much for your help! It is very important that each region from Scotland to India, and Scandinavia to North Africa needs to be covered. It helps with the recruitment of troops and the enemies that face Rome.

 

I wish I could implement all of those tribes into the game, but the hardcoding limits limit the map to how many cities it can have.

 

It must be a moded map if it reaches/includes India.

RTW has a map of Italy for a short tutorial campaign that, I think, starts around 280 BC

[Kosmo]

Hordes are tough to beat!

 

If you use the BI engine you could have an Eastern Celtic horde in the Balkans/Anatolia because this is when celts raided Macedonia and killed it's king and when they established Galatia and the Tylis kingdom

[ahowl11 HRTW Mod Leader]

here are the links!

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=468044

http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?372-Historical-Rome-Total-War

 

Yes it is a modded map.

The first version focuses on the Vanilla map

 

We do have a celtic tribes faction!

They will have Tylis and have some armies around Greece, the Galatians will belong to the Gaul faction. I do not know if they will horde or not

 

Should I post a new topic on Sicily or put it in this topic?

Edited October 24, 2011 by ahowl11 HRTW Mod Leader

[Kosmo]

Leave it here.

[ahowl11 HRTW Mod Leader]

Alright well here is my knowing of Sicily in 280 B.C.

 

Messana was owned by the Mamertines

Syracuse was an Independant Kingdom and was a power

 

Was Agrigentum an Independant city state as well?

 

Carthage controlled the west side, owning Lilybaeum,

 

Who controlled Panormus?

 

Carthage occupied Malta, Sardinia, and Corsica to right?

 

And were the native Sicels prominent at this time?

thanks

[Pompieus]

Agathoclese, tyrant of Syracuse had died in 289 and this was the signal for the Siciliot Greeks to fall into political chaos (as usual). Tyrants had siezed many of the cities, there was civil war in others and the Mamertine mercenaries had siezed Messana and the Northeast corner of the island. The tyrant of Agrigentum (Acragas) was besieging Syracuse, and the Carthaginians were taking advantage of the situation to extend their control. When a Carthaginian fleet turned up at Syracuse while the siege was in progress the Greeks came to their senses and combined to ask Pyrrhus for help in 279-78.

 

The Carthaginians held the Western part of the island including Lilybaeum, Panormus (Palermo) and Segesta plus Greek Selinus and probably Heraklea Minoa. In 280 they were probably moving in on Thermae on the North coast and extending their influence over the Sicels who at this time were usually under the suzerainty of the strongest power. Syracuse no longer dominated the Greek towns but with Agrigento and Gela and others united (for a time) under Pyrrhus' leadership for fear of Carthage.