Fatboy's Sig

[P.Clodius]

Fatboy, how similar is Irish celtic to Scotish and Welsh? And how similar are those to that which would have been spoken by the Galic tribes?

[longbow]

There was a extensive DNA test done some years back on G.Britain,it showed that the Irish and Scots had mainly Norse DNA.The Welsh were the only people tested who had mainly Celtic DNA.Hope this helps L

[longbow]

ohh,your talking about the language sorry.L

[Fatboy]

P,

Well, the relationship of Irish toward these languages differs greatly between the two, and its relationship to ancient Gaulish is more complicated again.

 

They all derive of course from ancient Celtic which probably began to form from the same archaic indo- european language(s) as Latin and Greek in the late Bronze age. The Celts expanded westward from a starting point believed to be in central Europe and reached the British Isles some time before 1,000 BC bringing their language with them. The relative isolation of these islanders has resulted in the establishment of two distinct branches of Celtic. This split still exists between surviving Celtic languages today.

 

The chief remaining " living " Celtic languges are Irish, Scottish, Welsh, Cornish, Manx and Breton.

They each belong to one of the two branches: Goidelic or Q-Celtic and Brythonic or P-Celtic

This is how they are split

The Goidelic group is: Irish, Scottish and Manx

The Brythonic group is: Welsh, Cornish and Breton

 

Goidelic is the older of the two, brought to Britain with the original Celtic settlers. Brythonic developed later on the continent but did not readily spread to the islands. It was only much later that P-Celtic reached the islands where it replaced the Q-Celtic culture in the southern part of Britain. The most obvious difference between the two is the substitution in Brythonic of a P for the Q in Goidelic. The sound represented by Q in goidelic was later replaced by a hard C while the P remained in Brythonic.

Here are some examples:

The English word:......................son

In Goidelic:...............................mac

In Brythonic languages:.............(m)ap ( welsh )

...............................................mab ( breton )

...............................................map ( cornish )

 

The English word:......................head

In Goidelic:...............................ceann ( Irish )

............................................... ceann ( Scottish )

................................................kione ( Manx )

In Brythonic:.............................pen ( Welsh )

................................................penn ( Breton )

................................................penn ( Cornish )

 

The differences of course run much deeper than this.

The first line of the " Our Father " prayer for example:

English:........Our Father, who art in heaven, halowed be thy name.

Irish:............

[P.Clodius]

Do you speak Irish, or more correctly Gaelic?

[Fatboy]

There is no one Gaelic as such but Gaelic languages like Scottish and Welsh.

We speak modern Irish a Gaelic language, although most Irish people only have a rudimentary knowledge of it remembered from school.

To say I speak Irish would be very generous description of my abilities. I can speak a kind of pidgin Irish at best. I sometimes talk with my friends in Irish but we generally use only a few simple words and phrases.

 

Cen fath.................Why

Ca bhuil tu..............Where are you?

Nil fhois agam..........I don't know

Tigim.......................I understand/ I know

Bigim.......................I will

Phroimplan...............Idiot/ fool literally " a pimple "

 

That sort of thing. Many of the Irish words are misused and we would be incapable of a sustained conversation. Not many Irish people would complain about the fact that English has become our first language, certainly not me, English being the almost universal language of the media that it is. Officially Irish is still our first language but this is little more than a gesture.

There are still some entirely Irish speaking areas in Ireland but for the most part the language seems to be dying unfortunately. The relatively new Irish speaking TV channel, TG4 is making an effort to reverse this trend by being one of the best stations around in my ( but not many other peoples ) opinion.

[P.Clodius]

I've know quite a few Irishmen in my life. I served with quite a few in the Brit Army when I was in. A lot of people don't know this but Irish Republic nationals can join the Brit Army. All the guys that I met in the military were the salt of the earth. Coming over to the US though has introduced me to a new breed, namely the Irish American. Now, this may sound like a blanket statement but these guys can be real a$$holes. They think Britain and Ireland are in a perpetual state of war.

[Moonlapse]

Coming over to the US though has introduced me to a new breed, namely the Irish American. Now, this may sound like a blanket statement but these guys can be real a$$holes.

ROFL!! Very astute!