Statue found may be rare depiction of a young Nero

[JGolomb]

Whatever happened to all the Neros?

There's no real mention of why they now think this is a young Nero...the statue was discovered 40 years ago.

 

Archaeologists believe a statue of a boy's head may be a depiction of one of the most hated Roman Emperors.

The head found at Fishbourne Roman Palace, West Sussex, will undergo a 3D scan to see if it is a rare marble statue of Emperor Nero as a young boy.

 

If it is, it would be only the third surviving piece of its kind in the world.

 

Every other depiction of him was destroyed when he committed suicide after being declared an enemy of the state in AD 68.

 

The Fishbourne statue was found in 1964, but until recently it was always believed to be that of King Togidubnes or a member of his family.

 

But Dr Rob Symmons, curator of archaeology at Fishbourne, will join forces with Bournemouth University lecturers Dr Miles Russell and Harry Manley, who will run scans on the head and recreate the damaged parts of the face, to test the theory that it could in fact be the emperor.

 

Dr Symmons said: 'This is very exciting as the scan will allow us to see for the first time what the boy really looked like and may also reveal his identity.

 

'We have always assumed he was related to the Royal family who lived here but it may be that it is even more special and is a rare depiction of Nero.'

 

Two of the best-known examples of the teenage Nero are portraits preserved in the Museo Nazionale d'Antichita in Parma and the Musee du Louvre in Paris.

 

Both representations are thought to have been created as part of the official recognition that Nero was on his way to becoming chief heir of Claudius.

 

The rounded cheeks and full, curving lips of the Fishbourne piece almost exactly match the features of the young Nero on display in Parma and Paris, as do the rounded lower face, slightly protruding ears, curling locks of hair and almond-shaped eyes.

 

Dr Russell said: 'They tried to eradicate the fact that Nero ever existed. This particular head is extremely well made in a very expensive type of marble and someone has taken an axe to it and smashed it almost to oblivion. Why else would they do that?'

 

The scan will be carried out on October 15.

[JGolomb]

Came across a little more info in this story from Science Daily and includes a new photo. Provides, to me at least, a little more clarity as to why they think this may be Nero.

 

Laser Scans To Confirm Nero's Return: 21st Century Scan Could Reveal Rare Sculpture Of 1st Century Roman Emperor

 

from this new article:

Two of the best-known examples of the teenage Nero are preserved in the Museo Nazionale d

[sylla]

Dr Russell said: 'They tried to eradicate the fact that Nero ever existed. This particular head is extremely well made in a very expensive type of marble and someone has taken an axe to it and smashed it almost to oblivion. Why else would they do that?'

Quicumque vult salvus esse, ante omnia opus est, ut teneat catholicam fidem:

Quam nisi quisque integram inviolatamque servaverit, absque dubio in aeternam peribit.

Fides autem catholica haec est: ut unum Deum in Trinitate, et Trinitatem in unitate veneremur.

Neque confundentes personas, neque substantiam seperantes.

Alia est enim persona Patris alia Filii, alia Spiritus Sancti:

Sed Patris, et Fili, et Spiritus Sancti una est divinitas, aequalis gloria, coeterna maiestas.

Qualis Pater, talis Filius, talis Spiritus Sanctus. Increatus Pater, increatus Filius, increatus Spiritus Sanctus.

Immensus Pater, immensus Filius, immensus Spiritus Sanctus.

Aeternus Pater, aeternus Filius, aeternus Spiritus Sanctus.

Et tamen non tres aeterni, sed unus aeternus

The head found at Fishbourne Roman Palace, West Sussex, will undergo a 3D scan to see if it is a rare marble statue of Emperor Nero as a young boy.

Edited January 1, 2010 by sylla

[JGolomb]

Statue fragment shown to be Nero

 

The proof is in!?

 

Full article and nice video in the link above...the 'proof' is clarified below. :-/

 

Experts say they have proved a statue fragment found in West Sussex depicts the Roman emperor Nero as a young man.

 

The digital image produced by the scanner was compared with the known depictions of Nero in Parma and Paris.

 

Dr Russell said he was 100% confident they matched.

 

"He has that very distinctive hair over his ears and very distinctive almond eyes," he said.

In the video, Russell adds that the stone and quality also indicate it's genuine-ness

[sylla]

Statue fragment shown to be Nero

 

The proof is in!?

... Dr Russell said he was 100% confident they matched...

Nope, this is science; the proof is still far from being "in". It simply is not "out" yet.

 

What Dr Russell said is that he was 100% confident that the proof will eventually be "in"; now, all what is required is some patience to see if:

- the analysis of the measurable variables first,

- the independent replicable confirmation by other researchers later,

- and finally the ponderation of alternative explanations...

... will eventually prove that his a priori qualitative assessment of the match was right.

Edited October 19, 2009 by sylla

[JGolomb]

Statue fragment shown to be Nero

 

The proof is in!?

... Dr Russell said he was 100% confident they matched...

Nope, this is science; the proof is still far from being "in". It simply is not "out" yet.

 

What Dr Russell said is that he was 100% confident that the proof will eventually be "in"; now, all what is required is some patience to see if:

- the analysis of the measurable variables first,

- the independent replicable confirmation by other researchers later,

- and finally the ponderation of alternative explanations...

... will eventually prove that his a priori qualitative assessment of the match was right.

 

Here's a new video which includes a much more thorough explanation by Dr. Russell as to why he believes this will prove out to be a portraiture of a young Nero. He touches on much of what's been discussed in this thread. It's worth the 3+ minute viewing.

 

J

[sylla]

Statue fragment shown to be Nero

 

The proof is in!?

... Dr Russell said he was 100% confident they matched...

Nope, this is science; the proof is still far from being "in". It simply is not "out" yet.

 

What Dr Russell said is that he was 100% confident that the proof will eventually be "in"; now, all what is required is some patience to see if:

- the analysis of the measurable variables first,

- the independent replicable confirmation by other researchers later,

- and finally the ponderation of alternative explanations...

... will eventually prove that his a priori qualitative assessment of the match was right.

 

Here's a new video which includes a much more thorough explanation by Dr. Russell as to why he believes this will prove out to be a portraiture of a young Nero. He touches on much of what's been discussed in this thread. It's worth the 3+ minute viewing.

 

J

Thanks for all your efforts, Jason. This is a beautiful video; however, the evidence shown there is fundamentally the same already published by the same researchers, so the analysis remains fundamentally unchanged.

 

All along this thread we have a heavy publication bias, ie. using almost exclusively positive reports, even if in fact some of them are actually inconclusive.

 

I think this case is analogous to the story of the purported French bust of Caesar.

[JGolomb]

Thanks for all your efforts, Jason. This is a beautiful video; however, the evidence shown there is fundamentally the same already published by the same researchers, so the analysis remains fundamentally unchanged.

 

All along this thread we have a heavy publication bias, ie. using almost exclusively positive reports, even if in fact some of them are actually inconclusive.

 

I think this case is analogous to the story of the purported French bust of Caesar.

I think, for the moment, a conclusion rests on whether or not one accepts the credibility of the primary scientists: Dr Rob Symmons, curator of archaeology at Fishbourne, and Bournemouth University lecturers Dr Miles Russell and Harry Manley. We'll see if they come up with something a little more concrete.

 

Interesting thread all around...

 

J

[sylla]

I think, for the moment, a conclusion rests on whether or not one accepts the credibility of the primary scientists: Dr Rob Symmons, curator of archaeology at Fishbourne, and Bournemouth University lecturers Dr Miles Russell and Harry Manley. We'll see if they come up with something a little more concrete.

Quicumque vult salvus esse, ante omnia opus est, ut teneat catholicam fidem:

Quam nisi quisque integram inviolatamque servaverit, absque dubio in aeternam peribit.

Fides autem catholica haec est: ut unum Deum in Trinitate, et Trinitatem in unitate veneremur.

Neque confundentes personas, neque substantiam seperantes.

Alia est enim persona Patris alia Filii, alia Spiritus Sancti:

Sed Patris, et Fili, et Spiritus Sancti una est divinitas, aequalis gloria, coeterna maiestas.

Qualis Pater, talis Filius, talis Spiritus Sanctus. Increatus Pater, increatus Filius, increatus Spiritus Sanctus.

Immensus Pater, immensus Filius, immensus Spiritus Sanctus.

Aeternus Pater, aeternus Filius, aeternus Spiritus Sanctus.

Et tamen non tres aeterni, sed unus aeternus

Edited January 1, 2010 by sylla