Pertinax

Spartan, the blue quoted portions are difficult to read. Maybe I'm the only one with that problem. No your not! Could you change it please Spartan? Id like to read the full post!

I am waiting for some favourable weather before going on photo recce to the more photogenic parts of the wall. I am presently re-reading Sawley's "Oxford History of Roman Britain", and this gives a good broad brush picture of the military and political activities leading to the construction/modification of the wall. The book strongly conveys the idea that one can consider the areas to the south of the wall being offered "shelter" by the wall to prevent unwholesome combinations of tribes ( internally within the Brigantes I wish to emphasise , though not excluding others as the Brigantes seemed to be present almost into Caledonii territory) , whilst "natural" romanisation progressed healthily.The whole tone of this scholarly work leaves no doubt that although Britain was a fabulous wild frontier it had , by trade ( and by the Roman destruction of the Venetii) inoxerably drawn itself into the outer framework of the Empire even if the very consumers of those goods opposed Rome.An interesting side issue is the consturction of fortifications and the concentration of personnel for a possible Hibernian campaign. Glannaventa (Ravenglass) of which you may find photos in my "historical sites" gallery is strictly the western end of the fortifications considerd as a functioning entity.Lugovallium (Carlisle) is the modern western signifier of the built wall , (and was the key site for senior military presence on the wall).A chain of defences and forts connected these two localities. The advance to the Antonine Wall is a very subtle and interesting change, indeed this activity displays the shrewd nature of the eponymous Emperor.That occupation of the two walls (and the Gask Ridge) ebbed and flowed thereafter seems more related to the fortunes of the Empire and the position of the incumbent Emperor.This is not to denigrate any of Hadrian's work, though we see how "experimental" the layout work was in its earlier forms . The Vindolanda tablets , which I am also reading, are truly fascinating as they give an idea of the extreme normality of daily garrison life and logistical activity, a direct insight into the excellent communication skills of the time and the quality of produce consumed by ordinary rankers. Guy de la Bedoyere's "History and Guide " is the other useful book to read, this is in essence where to walk and what you will see on the way. Bedoyere makes the very telling point that the Wall was a forgotten entity until the mid 1840s -a millenium and a half of anonimity-just imagine if our cities, works and roads dissapear under such a fog of unknowing-though such is the fate of man. I might try a brief trip to Carlisle and put up some shots of the Castle and associated earlier items soon. Sawley by the way very scholarly but a little dry, you can hear the thoughts of a learned man processing carefully to the page. My Roman Frontier Map in the Gallery refers.(Miscellenia album). This has some additional notes.

I did drop a piece in somewhere about " eating the messengers of the Gods" -as I assume we are all obliged to by way of getting closer to the appropriate deity . I just had an excellent roast of belly Pork, thank you very much. trivia: I am aware that a celebrated supporter of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club attends matches bedecked in a string of blue and white sausages.

sorry bout that I was scything through proper definitions in my eagerness to talk about the vessels used.

ADs "dangerous tastes" book will also give some linkage to your remarks about the extent of Roman trade/influence/movement in an adjacent thread in this forum (beyond the frontiers).

Andrew Dalby is a forum member look at his bibilography, and his "food word" site ( it links via his signature on any message). Have a look at Patrick Faas also . I have reviewed books by both gentlemen on the forum , The AD review is in Viggen's war chest pending publication on here, the Faas review is in one of the two "food " threads on this forum. That should get you going! http://www.coquinaria.nl/english/recipes/garum.htm heres the link I was trying to find yesterday! Anything about beer link to Pantagathus's site , what he doesnt know can be written on the back of a stamp.Just go to his profile to get the link , the entries are "modern" but his knowledge is based ona great depth of historical knowledge.

The Nam Pla is a similar liquid-essentially a flavour enhancer made of strong fish "sauce" and a natural source of monosodium glutamate, this is a substitute for salt in effect , for flavouring a stew (of meat or fish) for eaxample. If you enjoy savoury or very rich foods the Nam Pla is exquisite. Roman cooking has few references to salt as an ingredient in the preparation of foods but dozens citing the use of garum. http://www.italiancookingandliving.com/foo...t/ac_garum.html heres a quick link , if you root about in my older food threads ("another roman recipe" and "most trrrible thing youve had for dinner") we have discussed the topic before (if briefly). The best garum was from fermented tuna head/entrails and blood.

is this the "perseus" http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/ resource you are trying to link to?

may I share this link with you all http://www.glassonsmokehouse.co.uk/ my xmas hamper came from here.

Nice! ' I would have to say pork if you are a respectable Roman of rank. And from your own farm perhaps an days travel from Rome? AD will tell us the authorised version im sure. Beef is a tricky subject as cows milk was not at all popular and bulls were, I believe, of considerable sacrificial significance . Papyrus as the parchment roasting wrap as well. Nam Pla is my Garum ! You can host the feasting anytime Pantagathus!

This would be the defeat of the Icenii-who outnumbered the Romans (vastly) ,and brought everyone along to enjoy the show. Hubris. The wedge re-appears as the a-Viking "swine array" -the best counter technique is said to be another "sows head" to break the momentum gallery note:I have a swine array monument photo in my Eboracvm album casualty rates for both this battle and mons graupius were in both cases -Rome :nominal (if one can say such a thing) Locals :vast. The decisive action in both battles seems to be fire discipline and the pilum discharge into attackers lured into making an attack, then having lost momentum being penned in and being mercilessley cut down by the gladius-and auxiliary cavalry. At mons graupius even the "beserkers" (though that was not then the appropriate name) of the Caledonii were pushed off the battlefield.

Sorry I was not clear in my meaning-all these things were at some point rendered down in lead lined vessels, the sweeter the end product it seems the more lead one consumed (logical really). It may be suggested that kohl eye makeup is possible source of trouble, given ,that lead and antimony were said to be used in its production. However much of the exported Egyptian product was charred Frankincensce gum. this new learning amazes me Sir Bedevere!

Is it the same as Passum? (which i believe is reduced new wine/must) As you say, passum was used extensively as a sweetener. (or caroenum?) On a different note, did I read correctly that the Romans used large wood-log piping in Britain? I think Passum is another term and defritum also, Garum was probably reduced in a similar way . Yes well done on the pipes-I think sophisticated townies got lead and out in the country it was as much wood as you could eat. and caroenum also!

Nicely done Skarr, and I enjoyed the review Ursus! a couple of talking points if I may- I detect a Victorian Christian Britain transforming to a post-modern "liberal " ( what a riseable term) Cool Brittania here , very much as I saw a parallel in HBOs Rome. I know every generation thinks it has invented sin and sexuality but the Republic as a prototype Victorian "Moral Heart " of a muscular christian empire certainly has some amusing resonance, (especially given the Victorian obsession with Roman Dignitas and Stoicism), even the clothes sound similar. The comment about womens clothes is very interesting , a lot of people suggest that wearing a huge amount of fabric and decorative embellishment shows a subservient role-I suggest it is power dressing on a fearsome scale , the occupation of about a cubic metre of space by one person does not seem to suggest servility, ok it may be conspicuous consumption as a spouse -but the truly marginal wear old sacks and are dirtyand occupy a small cringing space. Britons were notorious for sexual licence and promiscuity around the "invasion" period, also a splendid , immoderate and wholehearted drunkeness.Fortunately we have been able to reclaim our ancestral rites! These are not "issues" with Skarr's excellent post, I was just turning a couple of thoughts over for public consideration.

I have heavily re-edited my previous post here , and would welcome comment from Mr Dalby on the sapa production . I have two questions to those knowledgable about Byzantium-what was the plumbing like? was lead used in food/drink production? If we have continuity of usage then the pro-plumbum party are in a tricky tactical position.

Difficult one to call-if we believe Tacitus ,then jealousy was the reason for withdrawal. The revenue earning capability and population density were very much below other "twilight" ares of the Roman map, so as a tactical move it seems not unreasonable. If we are to believe early commentators then the whole colonisation was an exercise in prestige and a demonstration of technological prowess. In another thread I recall a (modern) quote that Caesars initial campaign was as daring as the first moon landing in relative technological and logistical terms. Many Romans actually doubted the existence of such a fabulously remote, inhospitable and homicidally populated land.The constant thread in commentaries is Brittania as a proving ground for martial excellence and courage above all other stations in the Empire.The mining centres were all thoroughly under Roman control, despite the ocassional Brigantian turbulence and although we have the reclaimed lands in the Wash area the land was not a key granary . Scotland would , I suggest be the equivalent of fighting in the Falklands-though with more "hostiles" as natives.There is evidence of traded goods from the land of the Vacomagi-( Elgin-Aberdeen crudely expressed) so Roman "reach" was very long.

Do you have an overly libidinous-lascivious, extremely outspoken radio/TV personality that has ladies come to the studio and take their clothes off? Actually no.But I see a niche market.

I understand Leone had to make do with "leftover" film to actually shoot with-some old cans that were lying about ready for the junk heap that had partly degraded because of age. The dubbing is appalling but everybody sweats convincingly in close-up.

can anyone give me a cross cultural reference here-the gentleman is not known in Brigantia