Germanicus

Must be an omen.

Pity Rodney Dangerfield passed away, I'd would have loved to see him in a Roman outfit, wisecracking. Suspect I would have got more out of it than a Vin Diesel version too.

Or maybe I should have just called myself Tiberius (that guy had no sense of humor)

Considering what we know today of what turns a modern person into a Psychopath, or a serial killer. Do you think that Roman society would have had a higher proportion of these mental types ? Both in the Army and in the general population ? Because of what people witnessed in their early/formative years ? I started thinking about it while reading Tacitus descriptions of the German legions uprising after the death of Augustus. Little Gaius as a small child was there, and may well have witnessed the troops dealing with the leaders of the mutiny in their own ranks, by hacking them to pieces one by one, and we know how little Gaius turned out. Were children permitted entry to watch the games ?

We're not discussing whether Germanicus was poisoned or just got sick - you'll be relieved to know. I'm not interested in discussing that either.

Yes, a quick assasination would have been the way to go. Germanicus had Praetorian cohorts with him in lower Germany to help supress the mutiny and should have sorted things out with them before their return to Rome. I can understand him being reluctant to just head down with his legions, after 40 years of peace he may not have wanted to plunge the populace into Civil war again, what a guy !

But then, if they hadn't imposed the humiliating stipulations of the treaty in the first place, Hitler may not have found it so easy to win support at home. Nelson Mandela anyone ?

Thats why you're "The Enforcer" Ursus. Anyone else - Or was Germanicus the only true duty bound self sacrificer among us ?

Augustus is dead, the legions in Lower Germany and Pannonia are rioting, those in Upper Germany would be easily convinced. They don't respect Tiberius nearly as much as you, the people love you too, and the Legion representatives are begging you to take the purple - you'd have 8 veteran legions at your command. What would you do in Germanicus position ?

A lot of middle earth Languages sound like others, Tolkien was a linguist, don't know for sure but I suspect he spoke Gaelic.

The Bull was used by Legions raised by Caesar in Spain, "a symbol as popular in Spain then as it is now"(1) Legions often used a symbol popular in their traditional recruiting grounds, and they for the most part also displayed their birthsign on their standards, that is, their Astrological birthsign. If a Legion was enlisted in March, they would have displayed the fish of Picses etc etc. I do not believe that all Caesaren Legions standards included a Bull, a number of Caesarean Legions were raised by Pompey prior to Caesars governership of Spain, and were simply taken over by him. Considering the importance and tradition involved in Legionary standards, they would not have changed with each new commander. IMO As for uniform differences, I agree with Primus Pilus, strictly related to Geography. Possibly during civil wars there would have been a color sash or some other such identifying mark. But then, Legionaries at least in veteran legions fought next to the men they messed with, and used a buddy system. The standard length of service from Marius to Augustus was 16 years, 20 after that. So when actually in battle, considering the way Romans fought, as a unit, I think they would have easily picked friend from foe (if a foe happened to get between sheilds and into their lines). The other thing to think about is that If I was Caesar, I may well have tried some subterfuge during a battle against Pompey, simply by having a couple of cohorts wear his colors. The watchword was the only sure identifier. (1)DANDO-COLLINS, Stephen "Caesars Legion"

A grizzled old western looking man in ancient Chinese dress begins to tell the story....mmmm....good idea Virgil.

I've almost finished The twelve Caesars, and am enjoying it in the same way one can enjoy a good gossip column. However, I read that he is quite accurate on Augustus and to some extent Tiberius, but that after writing those two chapters was denied any further access to Imperial records, having been fired from the position of chief secretary on Hadrians staff for being impolite to the Empress. I note though, that he was born in AD 69, and presume that there would have been a number of older people alive through his teens to his comming of age, who had lived through the reigns of Caligula, Nero etc, and so wonder if at least some of his anecdotes regarding these Emperors are in fact accurate, at least those alledging "public" crimes of tyranny. A number of his claims are obviously beaten up, half truths aimed and degrading earlier reigns to glorify later ones, and probably just to sell books too. What do people think ? Has anyone made a serious attempt and going through his "facts" and classifying his claims as either believable or unbelievable ?

Yeah, I agree with him being largely overlooked and certainly a great general in his own right. I guess his problems stemmed from 1:-Being unpopular with his men. 2:-Living in the same time period as Pompey 3:-Essentially giving up back at Rome after Pompey swept in to mop up what Lucullus started in the east. Becoming so shattered that he devoted the rest of his days to depravity and dinner parties.

The ram being battering ram, the implication of the saying would be that the seige is as good as over once the rams head touches the wall. I've never heard that saying before though, but I like it.

It's Germanicus PP, not PM, but as they say in Thailand, Mai Ben Lai (It doesn't matter)

I've often been and checked out the great images on these sites that I stumbled across - wondered if anyone else had:- C414-Republican sculpture Antonine Portraits Trajianic sculpture There's more than just these three. Hope you enjoy as much as I do. Flavian Portraits Julio-Claudian Portrait Sculpture

But he did have those massive Roman calves, so if he had a bike, he could have won. LOL Yeah, Vs threads are all fairly similar and similarly frustrating.

The point, as Ursus mentioned, was to take part is this extreem form of Epicureanism. Vommiting, so you could eat yet more delicious tidbits. In the same way that one may vommit today in an attempt to avoid a hangover tommorrow. I'm laboring things a bit here, but I dare say the Romans would have used a bucket rather than the floor, if they didn't have a pit for the exact purpose.

I saw a book the other day that looked like it dealt with just this, and will purchase it soon - called "Sulla, the last Republican" by Aurthur Keaveney.

If you're intersted in Auxiliary Cavalry operating in Northern Britain in general, the Vindolanda tablet translations provide some interesting information. I got a book from the British Museum. No mention of Longinus, they were before his time.

I used to think as you do DanM, that we of the modern age had grown beyond our genetic dispositions and had somehow become more enlightened than those in times passed. But I no longer hold that view, the older I get the more I realise that people lie, cheat, steal, rape and kill for wealth, religeon and politics just as much as they always have. I like this line Skarr. Actually the whole paragraph was well put.

I guess kind of like a cross between Interpol, Dinosaur Jnr, The Pixies, with a bit of Australian Crawl (I'm sure you won't know these guys from the 80s) thrown in for good measure. The meditations are a great source of inspiration to me in general, not just with music.

Goodfellas - Loved Ray Liotta Unforgiven - As someone already mentioned a great western Lord of the Rings Trilogy The 5th Element - Don't really know why, it just makes me forget about the day to day. The Mission - Film about franciscan monks in South America taking sides with the native people against the Spanish - made me cry and De Niro was good. Gladiator - Could have been so much better, but is still kick ass. Cube - Low budget SciFi with a really cool idea. The Breakfast Club - Loved it when a teen, a nostalgic fave Bladerunner Boyz in the Hood - Just really enjoyed it, something so far removed from my own experience, was an eye opener at the time. I was tempted to put King Arthur in just to annoy Longbow, but couldn't bring myself to do it....it really is a crap film. Zeke - Curious to know why you hated Sin City so much ???

Caesar hands down. Imagine Caesar had actually been in Trajans position ? Succeeding Nerva as an actual Emperor with no one to challenge him and his god given authority ? He may well have conquered the world, not just Dacia.