Nephele

Caldrail, I don't think the fact that the Romans held their gladiatorial combats in public (and private) spaces and wooden amphitheatres, or that "amphitheatres weren't just made of concrete," is news to anyone here. Did you presume that Maty's statement: "Particularly Roman innovations seem to have been gladiatorial shows, and fast-drying cement" implied that he was claiming that the Roman amphitheatres were made solely of concrete? I didn't get that impression at all, and fail to see how such a leap might have been made. But perhaps I'm mistaken. In any case, if Maty is inclined to respond, I'm sure he'll set the record straight. -- Nephele

TMI = "Too Much Information". As in: "Dude, I don't need to hear about your physical relationship with your mother's best friend. That's too much information." Generally subjects of a deeply personal and biological nature tend to be TMI. -- Nephele

The government of New Zealand isn't proposing to outlaw butter. It's a so-called "top public health expert" who is calling for a "health tax" on butter. Governmental response came from Associate Health Minister Damien O'Connor, who stated that "a health tax on butter would be naive and impractical." Read about it here As for the claim that "Margarine is but ONE MOLECULE from being PLASTIC..." This bit of hyperbole has been squelched by Snopes.com, which states: "The claim that some comestible is but a 'single molecule away' from being a decidedly inedible (or even toxic) substance has been applied to a variety of processed foods...These types of statements...are essentially meaningless. Many disparate substances share similar chemical properties, but even the slightest variation in molecular structure can make a world of difference in the qualities of those substances." See The Butter Truth. An excess of time on one's hands could be well spent at the Snopes website. -- Nephele

The Olympic torch arrived today in your town, DoL. What's a Blues Sister to do? Why, don sunglasses and dark hat, say "We're on a mission from god," and with some acrobatic backflippin' dance moves guide that torch safely through the streets of San Francisco today -- while later on in the day single-handedly liberating Tibet. It's a win-win situation for all. Hail the Blues. -- Nephele

We Yanks appear to have received the best of Rome's legacy. Interesting! Can you dig up for us some illustrations of early Roman vending machines? -- Nephele

Thats an advance? Caldrail, you omitted "fast-drying cement" from Maty's last sentence -- which was not only a genuine Roman innovation but also an advance. Not all innovations are necessarily advances and, while we don't have gladiatorial games today (at least, not practiced quite the same way as the Romans did), I appreciated Maty's irony in including gladiatorial games (a genuine Roman innovation) in his list. While I'm sure that most people here can agree that much was learned from the Romans, I believe that the point Maty was making was to separate genuine Roman innovations from those things for which the Romans may have been unduly credited with having originated. And, Maty and Longbow, I'd like to know more about those ball-bearings, too! (Which Longbow brought up earlier in this thread.) -- Nephele

So sorry about your situation, CS. Were you married to your children's mother, and now you're divorced? If so, then maybe there's some law that applies, that may prevent your former wife from moving your children too far away from you. I know that we have laws like that here in the U.S. Hope there's something that can be done to keep your kids close to you. -- Nephele

You may be thinking of the ancient Greeks, in whose houses the women were cordoned off in their own section, called the gynaikonitis. Roman town houses didn't have the same sort of "women's quarters" -- although that's not to say that menstruating Roman women may not have been confined to a room during the time of their menses on account of prevailing superstitions about menstruating women. But, as Lost Warrior stated previously, it's not something that's mentioned in a lot of sources. As for women of ancient times having had any opportunity to "get away from it all and be pampered..." I don't think any probable seclusion might necessarily have included pampering. While it's true that they might not have had their customary workload during their menses due to superstitions regarding their likelihood of withering garden plants and blunting steel with a mere glance (as Pliny tells us), I somehow doubt that they were packed off to the ancient equivalent of the day spa. If anything, it would have been a dismally boring time of inactivity for an otherwise bright and active young woman (despite what we read in novels such as Anita Diamant's The Red Tent). So, no, I don't agree that superstitions that lead to women's enforced seclusion -- and exclusion from society -- are "not a bad idea." -- Nephele

Clodia: A Sourcebook is at the top of my reading list. I've already placed my order. Bringing together works by Cicero, Catullus, and others in which Clodia plays a part, Julia Dyson Hejduk has produced a striking portrait of one of the most fascinating women in Roman history. Her accurate and accessible English translations include not only all the classical texts that mention Clodia, but also a substantial selection of Roman erotic poetry by Propertius, Tibullus, and Ovid. While many sourcebooks offer only small illustrative excerpts, Clodia provides most sources in their entirety, such as the Pro Caelio of Cicero, nineteen complete letters, all of Catullus's poems on "Lesbia" (his pseudonym for Clodia), and many subsequent love elegies. Julia Dyson Hejduk, Associate Professor of Classics at Baylor University, is the author of King of the Wood: The Sacrificial Victor in Virgil's Aeneid. -- Nephele

Thanks, GPM! And... oh my gosh, this is spooky but, while you were compiling the top five most popular praenomina, I was doing the same thing! I think you and I must be on the same wavelength! As for those top five gentes providing the most praenomina, that you compiled, those are actually the top five gentes providing the most magistrates during the time of the Republic. So that's why it appears that they provided the most praenomina. Anyway, my stats differed slightly from yours, regarding the most common praenomina among the gentes. Out of the 48 gentes and 1,670 individuals represented in my survey that I counted, a total of 27 different praenomina are represented. Each of these 27 praenomina is listed below, from most common to least common. The first number next to each praenomen represents the total occurrences of that praenomen in my survey. The next number in parentheses represents the total number of gentes in which that praenomen occurs. For those praenomina which only occurred in three or fewer gentes, I've listed the names of those gentes using that praenomen. The third number represents that praenomen's percent of frequency out of the total 1,670. Lucius 353 (46) 21% Gaius 278 (44) 17% Marcus 273 (40) 16% Publius 175 (34) 10% Quintus 153 (30) 9% Gnaeus 105 (20) 6% Aulus 76 (18) 5% Titus 54 (19) 3% Manius 37 (9) 2% Tiberius 32 (9) 2% Spurius 28 (10) 2% Servius 27 (3-Cornelius, Fulvius, Sulpicius) 1% Sextus 21 (10) 1% Appius 19 (1-Claudius) 1% Decimus 12 (3-Antonius, Iunius, Quinctius) 1% Caeso/Kaeso 7 (2-Fabius, Quinctius) less than 1% Numerius 6 (1-Fabius) less than 1% Agrippa 2 (1-Furius) less than 1% Mamercus 2 (1-Aemilius) less than 1% Opiter 2 (1-Verginius) less than 1% Proculus 2 (1-Verginius) less than 1% Hostus 1 (1-Lucretius) less than 1% Faustus 1 (1-Cornelius) less than 1% Pacuvius 1 (1-Antistius) less than 1% Paullus 1 (1-Aemilius) less than 1% Tullus 1 (1-Hostilius) less than 1% Vopiscus 1 (1-Iulius) less than 1% -- Nephele

We're all familiar with the fact that the Romans had very few praenomina in common use, and that some gentes were more inclined toward the use of certain praenomina. Such as the Claudii who, during the time of the Republic, appear to have used the praenomen of "Appius" exclusively (later on we find other gentes, particularly the Annii, using the praenomen of "Appius"). And the Aemilii, who appear to have used the praenomen of "Mamercus" exclusively. I present here a statistical survey of praenomina frequency in major gentes of the Republic. I am defining these major gentes as being those which provided a minimum of 15 magistrates throughout the time of the Republic, as identified by both praenomen and nomen gentilicium in Broughton's Magistrates of the Roman Republic. Nomina gentilicia taken from Broughton are listed below alphabetically, followed by their associated praenomina with the frequency of appearance of these praenomina (among the Republican magistrates) in parentheses. Where certain praenomina made up 25 percent or more of the total names within a represented gens, I have highlighted these praenomina in bold. ACILIUS: Manius (11), Marcus (4), Lucius (2) AELIUS: Gaius (5), Publius (5), Quintus (4), Lucius (3), Sextus (1), Titus (1) AEMILIUS: Marcus (22), Lucius (13), Manius (4), Quintus (3), Gaius (2), Mamercus (2), Publius (2), Tiberius (2), Titus (2), Paullus (1) ANNIUS: Titus (7), Gaius (5), Lucius (4), Marcus (2), Publius (2), Quintus (2), Sextus (1) ANTISTIUS: Lucius (7), Gaius (4), Marcus (2), Aulus (1), Pacuvius (1), Publius (1), Sextus (1), Tiberius (1), Titus (1) ANTONIUS: Marcus (6), Quintus (3), Gaius (2), Aulus (1), Decimus (1), Lucius (1), Titus (1) APPULEIUS: Lucius (7), Gaius (3), Marcus (3), Quintus (2), Sextus (2), Gnaeus (1), Publius (1) AQUILLIUS: Manius (6), Gaius (3), Lucius (3), Publius (3) ATILIUS: Marcus (10), Lucius (9), Gaius (7), Publius (3), Aulus (2), Sextus (2) AURELIUS: Lucius (10), Marcus (7), Gaius (5), Publius (1) BAEBIUS: Quintus (5), Gaius (3), Marcus (3), Gnaeus (2), Lucius (2), Aulus (1) CAECILIUS: Quintus (17), Lucius (10), Marcus (7), Gaius (6), Aulus (2) CASSIUS: Lucius (9), Gaius (7), Quintus (4), Marcus (1), Spurius (1) CALPURNIUS: Lucius (15), Gnaeus (6), Gaius (5), Marcus (4), Quintus (2), Publius (1) CLAUDIUS: Gaius (22), Appius (19), Marcus (17), Tiberius (9), Publius (6), Quintus (3), Lucius (2) CORNELIUS: Publius (62), Lucius (44), Gnaeus (34), Aulus (10), Servius (10), Marcus (9), Gaius (5), Faustus (1), Quintus (1) DOMITIUS: Gnaeus (12), Lucius (3), Marcus (2) FABIUS: Quintus (29), Gaius (12), Marcus (10), Numerius (6), Kaeso (5), Lucius (3), Gnaeus (2) FONTEIUS: Manius (4), Gaius (3), Publius (3), Marcus (2), Aulus (1), Tiberius (1), Titus (1) FULVIUS: Marcus (10), Gnaeus (7), Quintus (7), Gaius (4), Servius (2), Aulus (1), Lucius (1), Publius (1) FURIUS: Lucius (19), Gaius (6), Marcus (6), Spurius (6), Publius (5), Agrippa (2), Quintus (1), Sextus (1) GENUCIUS: Lucius (6), Gnaeus (3), Gaius (2), Marcus (2), Titus (2) HOSTILIUS: Lucius (6), Gaius (5), Aulus (3), Publius (1), Tullus (1) IULIUS: Lucius (17), Gaius (13), Sextus (7), Gnaeus (2), Vopiscus (1) IUNIUS: Marcus (21), Decimus (12), Gaius (6), Lucius (6), Publius (3), Quintus (2), Titus (2) LICINIUS: Gaius (17), Publius (15), Lucius (11), Marcus (8), Aulus (3), Sextus (1), Spurius (1) LUCRETIUS: Lucius (4), Marcus (4), Spurius (3), Publius (2), Quintus (2), Gaius (1), Gnaeus (1), Hostus (1), Titus (1) MANLIUS: Aulus (17), Lucius (14), Titus (10), Gnaeus (5), Publius (4), Marcus (3), Quintus (2), Gaius (1) MARCIUS: Quintus (18), Lucius (9), Gaius (7), Marcus (5), Gnaeus (2), Manius (1), Publius (1) MEMMIUS: Gaius (7), Lucius (6), Quintus (1), Titus (1) MINUCIUS: Quintus (9), Marcus (8), Lucius (5), Gaius (3), Tiberius (3), Publius (2), Spurius (1), Titus (1) OCTAVIUS: Gnaeus (10), Marcus (6), Gaius (3), Lucius (3), Publius (1) PAPIRIUS: Lucius (19), Gaius (13), Marcus (7), Gnaeus (2), Manius (2), Spurius (2), Publius (1), Quintus (1), Tiberius (1) PLAUTIUS: Gaius (10), Lucius (7), Marcus (4), Publius (3), Aulus (2) POMPEIUS: Gnaeus (6), Quintus (5), Sextus (4), Aulus (3), Lucius (1), Marcus (1), Titus (1) POMPONIUS: Marcus (12), Lucius (3), Quintus (3), Aulus (1), Gaius (1), Gnaeus (1), Manius (1), Sextus (1), Titus (1) POPILLIUS: Gaius (7), Publius (6), Marcus (5), Quintus (1), Titus (1) PORCIUS: Marcus (10), Lucius (5), Publius (3), Gaius (2) POSTUMIUS: Lucius (14), Aulus (12), Spurius (8), Marcus (4), Gaius (2), Publius (2), Quintus (1) QUINCTIUS: Titus (13), Lucius (9), Gaius (2), Quintus (2), Caeso (1), Decimus (1), Gnaeus (1), Kaeso (1), Tiberius (1) SEMPRONIUS: Gaius (14), Tiberius (12), Publius (7), Aulus (6), Lucius (5), Marcus (5), Titus (2) SERGIUS: Marcus (7), Lucius (4), Manius (3), Gaius (2), Gnaeus (1), Publius (1) SERVILIUS: Gaius (18), Quintus (12), Publius (10), Gnaeus (6), Marcus (5), Spurius (3), Lucius (1) SULPICIUS: Servius (15), Gaius (14), Publius (7), Quintus (5), Lucius (1) TERENTIUS: Aulus (5), Gaius (4), Marcus (3), Quintus (3), Gnaeus (1), Lucius (1), Publius (1) VALERIUS: Marcus (25), Lucius (20), Gaius (12), Publius (8), Manius (5), Quintus (3) VERGINIUS: Aulus (5), Lucius (5), Titus (3), Opiter (2), Proculus (2), Spurius (1) VETURIUS: Lucius (4), Titus (3), Gaius (3), Spurius (2), Tiberius (2), Marcus (1), Publius (1) -- Nephele

You must now give your new friends Maori names! -- "Newhera"

That's your great-grandfather's store? -- Nephele

GPM, how about you extend an invitation to Boris to join us here at UNRV? Since he's running for public office, you should be able to find his contact information easily. -- Nephele

jcl3341, you are a member of the Horatii, an ancient patrician gens which spawned the famous, battling Horatii triplets. Your cognomen is "Lanio", which means "I tear to pieces," indicating the ferocity of your particular branch of the Horatii. Your praenomen is "Aulus", customarily abbreviated as "A." Your full Roman name is: A. Horatius Lanio = rlnnsaojtnoaah -jnn +iiu Welcome to UNRV! -- Nephele

Oooo, gothy! I may part with a few sestercii for that one, myself. Particularly that logo on the Women's Long Sleeve Dark T-Shirt. -- Nephele

I figured that's what you meant. I just get a little teeth-grindingly ill-tempered at the very mention of that gasbag's name. LOL! -- Nephele

Could be Bob Barr. I don't care if former Patriot Act supporter Bob Barr is now calling himself a Libertarian, he would never get my vote. Not posting this link because I'm in the Obama camp (I'm not), but because the blogger expresses my view of that distasteful phony, Barr. -- Nephele

It does seem almost comical -- a couple dozen Roman senators eagerly rushing en masse as though they were unruly children at a party and Caesar were the birthday pi

You did good. Real good. -- Nephele

I breed my own evil minions! -- Nephele

Silly question time: Are you planning to give your new laptop a name? Just asking, because I have friends who name their computers. And, I remember you'd given a name to your new harp. -- Nephele

That's a delicious What-If: What if the Book of Enoch had been substituted for the Book of Revelation? To me, the much-overlooked Book of Enoch is perhaps the least distasteful of the so-called holy scriptures. And that's solely because of its coooool listing of the names of the fallen angels. What truly wonderful names to be found in Enoch! And they can be altered slightly to produce romantic-sounding, modern feminine names such as "Araqielle" and "Sariela". If I were inclined to have a child, and if it were a daughter, I would seriously consider consulting the Book of Enoch for some charming baby name ideas from amongst those demons listed there. -- Nephele

Your comparison of the Confederate States of America to Nazi Germany is a poor one. While I believe that all here agree that slavery was (and still is today in the world) an indefensible institution, it should be noted that the government of the Confederacy never subjected "their people to enslavement" -- as the slaves were never citizens to begin with. Just as the slaves of ancient Rome were not citizens. The Jews of Nazi-era Germany, however, were German citizens until the advent of the Nuremberg Laws on citizenship and race in 1935. Many of those Jews, in fact, fought in World War I on the side of the very nation that would later disenfranchise them (and worse). I'm not pointing this out to minimize or excuse the treatment of the slaves in the ante-bellum South. The process of dehumanization is the same -- whether an individual is made a captive slave in a land foreign to him, or whether a citizen discovers that he is suddenly a non-citizen in the nation which his family has called home for generations. But since you're defining a government's legitimacy by the treatment of "their people" (i.e. citizenry), I'm just saying that the government of the Confederacy didn't strip vested citizens of their rights in the way that Germany's Third Reich did. -- Nephele

Wow! But we would be fighting for the love of Julius Caesar. And if Marc Antony looked like Jame Purefoy, Russell Crowe, Christian Bale, I would let you have Caesar. Nah, I wouldn't be fighting for the love of Caesar. I just want his filthy lucre -- he can keep his Roman hands to himself. -- Nephele