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Everything posted by caldrail
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The problem with reliefs and sculptures is that they weren't made by soldiers, so the artist often depicted things with some measure of license and then again, deliberately left off details for composition or simply to allow painters to fill in the necessary detail later. The image above is fairly typical in that it 'suggests' a scene rather than records one like a photograph. It should therefore be understood that the depictions of salutes are not necessarily military ones but might actually be civilian in origin. Also, we have little or no idea whether the salute was a formal institution or simply a gesture carried out according to prevailing social trends - did salutes remain the same for hundreds of years? Possibly, but given the relative lack of detailed information on Roman drills can we be sure of that?
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Top Five fighters of WWII and why
caldrail replied to Northern Neil's topic in Historia in Universum
No, you're all completely wrong. The best ever british fighter of WW2 was the Martin Baker MB5, which sadly did not arrive quickly enough to see service and was obstructed politicially from doing so because the Ministry of Supply wanted Martin Baker to contract for other companies production. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin-Baker_MB_5 One test pilot recommended that the cockpit layout should be made stabndard for single engined fighters - albeit a little late in the day. In the words of Aeroplane Monthly "It remains a minor mystery why this fighter was never put into production". After the relative disappointment of the MB3 project the '5' was a much better aeroplane, which attracted no major criticism from test pilots at all. Please inform Mr Clarkson that he ought to learn a bit of aviation history first. Sorry. Couldn't resist that. -
Nonsense, Marco Polo rode a horse to China and back. He travelled there and back certainly but his exact route is not recorded. Roman Legionnaires appear to have ended up in China after their capture at the battle of Carrhae. When the Mongols reached eastern Europe they were asking for the location of Rome. Rome was aware of China and China was aware of Rome. Those Romans reached China as slaves, though this has yet to be proven. As such they wouldn't necessarily have been taken there directly but traded eastward by a number of routes. Certainly sea routes were preferable they were much quicker but people will still have used the land routes. We know that greek ships were trading in the Idian Ocean and it's thought some of them reached Cambodia. There's no confirmation that western vessels of that era actually reached Chinese shores. As for the land routes, these were a series of short journeys by local merchants, not caravans setting out to reach the east. However, the Roman Empire was reached by chinese travellers more than once and note that in the campaign of the late nineties, the chinese expeditionary forces under Pan Ch'ao were persuaded by the PArthians not to confront or parley with Trajans legions who had reached the Caspian Sea at the same time. Both armies were as close as two days march from each other and the last thing the Parthians wanted was east and west coming to some agreement - it would spell the end of the lucrative tolls imposed on land trade across their territory. During the american gold rush most people sensibly came by ship. Either crossing overland at Panama or across Nicaragua up river by ship and crossing overland a distance of 10 miles on the Vanderbildt route. Or circumnavigating South America by sail ship. None the less many people came overland some pushing their belongings in wheel barrows. These people were no more advanced than the people of the old world in ancient times. Not entirely true. We are talking about 19th century adventurers and settlers here. the spice route had many thousands of years to develop. No, it didn't. China was attracted to idea of trade with Rome by way of rumour of a mighty empire in the west (Indeed, the objective of Pan Ch'ao's expedition was to conquer Rome before he was recalled to deal with security closer to home). Therefore only with the existence of Rome's power did the chinese seriously consider travelling that far. That doesn't discount chains of local trade existing anyway of course but the 'road' to China was only open for 100-150 years before warfare closed it forever, making se travel far more desirable.
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I would assume so. Hollywood preserves many film traditions but typically doesn't like the restrictions of historical reality, which in this case we don't appear to have much information about. That's not to say the hollywood slaute is wrong, rather that it would be correct by a stroke of good fortune.
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Swindon is a place of opposites. A place that is comfortable with its future but not with its past. A place that aspires to be a city but cannot free itself of a small town attitude. A place that is ribbed by comedians and... well... deserves to be. This paragraph alone probably puts me on a council ninja hit-list but I shall not be silenced. I saw a letter in the local newspaper written by a concerned visitor. His Swindon experience was marred by the number of rats running round the old place. If you're not used to our jungle enviroment I imagine that was pretty shocking, but hey, at least he hasn't caught bubonic plague or something. Some people are so fussy. It seems peculiar to me that for a town that is constantly being chopped and changed, the citizens repeatedly say they like it how it is. What? Rats and all? They say that hot weather can bring changes in behaviour and not for the better. Over this october weekend (the hottest ever recorded) we had a street party outside my home. You know, the sort I'm not invited to? It was a gathering of lads, a feature of Swindons non-gay nightlife, where they were free to bellow, yell, and advertise their butchness to attract the females in the early house of friday and saturday night. So what makes them worthy of heroic status? Alcohol? Numbers? Volume? They really have no idea. But that's Swindon for you. Incidentially that was also verbal abuse the other night lads. I don't suppose you care too much (being all tough and macho) but I wonder how it would take take you to burst into tears if you got arrested for it? Ask any policeman. Hey... That reminds me... Where did you lads all get to last night? For The Better In other news I see the Conservative Party are holding their annual conference. I suppose I should say something about that. Not sure what though... Think of a word... Any word... Anyhow, I doubt the politicians gathered in Manchester will be discussing Swindon's rat problem. If it comes to that, I doubt they'll be discussing Swindon. More likely they'll be plotting to make the world a better place. Trust me guys, you're on a loser, Swindon's been trying to do that for ages. Trouble is we're stuck with the same people in it. And For The Worse Nothing lasts forever, and in englands wet and windy land, good weather soon gives way to something less desirable. The street party season is to close soon as the remnants of hurricane Ophelia are set to dampen our british spirits. So I'll be able to get some sleep then?
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You've tried them? You have no idea how true that is of Swindons fairer sex. Most are temperamental, bullying, foul mouthed, usually plump-esque and really not that attractive. Our town is way above average for under age sex and single parentage (I'm not responsible for that mind you - trust me, I haven't got the patience or body armour to cope) But all the same there is such a thing as tradition. We english persons like our traditions. Especially the sexier ones.
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The islamic expertise in medicine and other areas of knowledge is widley accepted. They had even evolved a system for mental health care in the early medieval period, employing musicians to calm their patients. To what extent this was influenced by classical texts is hard to say, because such information was rare to begin with, and the idea that the classical texts formed the basis of health care in the west is wrong, since we know that tradional remedies were used into medieval times rather than those preserved in literature which were not widely available, nor officially promulgated. Only with the establishment of a medical profession were classical texts re-evaluated and made a basis for understanding, since there was little else for them to rely on before the widespread acceptance of dissection and the industry of grave-robbing it inspired. In other words, medical care in earlier times is more closely based on direct study than reading of classical texts.
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The modern salute of a hand raised to eye level evolves from the middle ages where knights raised visors to reveal their faces as a matter of courtesy toward each other - Note that in the British Army it is incorrect to salute without wearing headress. The 'nazi' style of salute of a raised arm is a form of acknowledgement apparently used by politicians and emperors and preserved in statues, though I don't know whether this was a standard social custom or merely an instinctive one. In any case the posture is never depicted as rigid. It's unlikely that Roman soldiers used the same salute toward their officers. Clearly the Romans employed a salute as a mark of respect toward authority but I haven't seen any evidence for what form it took. Notice however that the salute could vary according to the rank of the person being honoured. There is no recorded system of gestures for this so we could reasonably assume that a verbal component is part of the ritual, so in other words, a soldier salutes and confirms his recognition of the persons rank by stating it.
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Now here I disagree. Not because I think the Romans were brilliant dioctors (which I don't - as you point out, they had limits on their skills and knowledge) but because we're thinking in terms of standards. That's a modern attribute. I do recognise that the Romans did evolve some standards such as basic measurements and plumbing (They used fittings of lead and bronze of set sizes) yet the medical profession in Roman times did not have colleges for training nor was there a hippocratic oath. Any idiot could call himself a physician and set up business. It would be my contention that the 'standard' of health care varied enormously.
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Yes it did. Definitely a good omen, fit to be ignored by Job Centre bureaucrats on orders from upstanding pillars of the community outraged at my outrageous attempt at DIY lording. But thanks for the offer of a prezzie. You really ought to have sent a serf to deliver it. You do need to think this way if you want to impress. Call it.. management training.
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This morning I sat through another shift at the museum. Come on people, why not pop in and learn something? What about you madam? Fancy a trip through history? No? What about you sir? Yes you. Why not save on your mobile phone charges by spending an hour on our premises? No? Hang on madam. That child of yours needs an education. Bring your little barbarian in here and put him off to a good start toward civilisation. No? And who is that woman who keeps walking past the museum in the same direction? Is she going around in circles for fun or is she hopelessly lost? Just at the point when depression and boredom was bringing me to the point of despair, Young L turned up. At last. He might not be the brainiest guy in the world but after hours of isolation on the front desk, start talking mate. You will talk. We have ways of making you talk. "Me Sir? No Sir" He replied in a silly voice. Erm... What? It turns out that was a quote from Jar jar Binks, a character from the Star Wars films who was probably an agent of the dark side only no-one noticed because of his silly accent and idiot behaviour. I reminded Young L that I was holding a pencil. It could get painful if he doesn't stop reminding me of the mental trauma that character imposed upon me. Sadly I was unable to act on my threat of physical violence when I discovered that Young L has been made the Front Desk Boss. Passed over for a football player? What is the world coming to? Naturally when discussing Star Wars the discussion inevitably arrives at Yoda, the loveable old muppet that trained the Jedi Knights to feel the force and find out who their fathers were. Ben Kenobi? Don't make me laugh. He didn't last the first film. On the other hand, Yoda reached a respectable 900 years of age. "But he's only one foot tall" Mentioned Young S, one of the Front Desk Knights defending the museum. Yes, well, you see people shrink with age, S. Yoda was probably eight feet tall at your age. I wonder how tall I'll be in 850 years time? Minus six feet I waould guess, though Young S assures me the russian wonder pill that makes people live for eight hundred years is almost ready for sale in the west. So could I be a frazzled green goblin wielding light sabres in mortal combat when I get old? Might need some fitness training. Wrong Button Years ago I took a young lady friend for a joyride in a cessna 150. Those aeroplanes are very compact, let me tell you, and snuggling up to an attractive woman is probably one of the best reasons for wanting to be a flying instructor. However, on this occaision she was wowed by the array of dials, levers, and switches on the panel in front of her. Well... This does that... And that does this... I have no idea what that button does so I never use it. Safety first. I see on the news that an airline pilot did use that button and immediately lost 6000 feet of altitude, almost flipping upside down in the process. Good grief. Am I glad I didn't mess with the wrong buttons. I remember that at the end of one such joyride I reminded the woman that the step on the landing leg was very small and if you miss it, you'll fall off the aeroplane, which was exactly what I did. There you go. That was a demonstration of what can happen if you climb out of an aeroplane in a clumsy fashion. I hope you were paying attention because I won't be repeating it. She looked at me with new found dismay. On Parade That was a hot day, especially at this time of year. Even late at night I was still sweating profusely. There I was, minding my own business, walking along the pavement without a care in the world, when up ahead a line of men all dressed identically in black jumpsuits and large chrome zips approached in a line, shoulder to shoulder, like a parade of the Special Hair Service. It was the strangest thing I've seen in quite a while, I can tell you. No idea who they were. Don't really want to know. Do have fun, chaps. Somewhere else though, okay?
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Thanks chaps - I knew you guys wouln't let me down What's fifty like? Well... Sort of like forty nine but with the bonus of eing relatively popular for a day or two. On the negative side, I have so far filed utterly to achieve a birthday kiss from a young lady. Just one of the hazards of growing old I guess
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The equite was the wealthiest class of citizen and because he could afford a horse, he was also the cavalry contingent, thus the derivation of the name, preserved in gladiatorial combat with a class of mounted fighter. later the equites became a sort of Roman middle class (though some commentators dislike that phrase) with increasing influence in government departments dating back to the reign of Claudius.
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Take a deep breath Caldrail. Today you are fifty years of age. Funny thing is I don't feel like I'm fifty, apart from the usual disintegration of the male body in middle age. They say you're as young as you feel and coincidentially I keep getting people telling me that I'm still young. It seems the average person has a very poor understanding of human biology. Fifty is one of those milestones in your life. Quite why the number fifty is significant is a matter of curiosity to me. There's no legal or cultural change at that age. I don't look any different. I don't feel any different. All I did was wake up this morning, study the crags in the bathroom mirror, and plodded off about my business as usual. Heaven forbid that I should take the day off from my jobsearch. Since they don't respect my title in any way whatsoever, I seriously doubt my birthday will impress them. That brings me to an interesting point. By now a typical reader might be speculating the orgy of festivites I'll be facing tonight. It's expected that I endure some large party to celebrate my fiftieth. I suppose in better circumstances I would. It is after all expected. There's almost a competitive element involved in which I must stage some spectacular celebration or be considered a loser, fit only be spurned and scorned. Let's be honest - it isn't going to happen. Fifty? Not this year. Does that make me miserable and upset? No. It doesn't. During the last weekend I attended a group discussion on how an individual can make a positive contribution to society. One young chap spoke up, a sufferer of Aspergers Syndrome, and he said that his life was being dragged down by those around him until he made a concious decision that happiness was his to command. That might seem a tiny or irrelevant thing to say but it wasn't. The fact that my fiftieth won't be marked by some massive party in which six hundred drunkards will fight to the death, several thousand chickens slaughtered in a mindless buffet, or teams of hot hatches racing around the local area in a daring attempt to win the honour of being crowned champion, is neither here nor there - though I suspect the police will be relieved. Okay, my world is not as wondeful as it might be. But who cares? Awww what the heck. I am going to take the day off. Don't care. It's my birthday and I'll enjoy it if I want to. Ding! What's that? Someones ringing my doorbell? Probably someone's got the wrong door, which is usually what happens, but you never know. It might be a birthday present sent to me by some kind person that needs signing for. Nope. It wasn't. Instead I was greeted by two plain clothes policemen. You mean... No... Surely not?... My stolen Eunos Cabriolet has been found? My hopes were cruelly dashed. Cast your mind back if you will but long time readers might remember that the Job Centre once began the rigmarole required to get me a shotgun license. All I ever did was make a sarcastic remark when I was in a bad mood and asked by a claims advisor if there was anything I needed. I never expected anyone to take that request seriously. One might have hoped they'd wish happy birthday but there you go. Anyhow, the policeman politely explained that someone had reported an attempt to obtain a firearm and they needed to eliminate me from their enquiries. Luckily they didn't seem to be armed. Aren't our policemen wonderful? That's what you get for having an argument with a jumped up arrogant busybody at the Job Centre I guess. No problem. I merely explained the circumstance and that the event had happened ages ago. The policemen left happy knowing I wasn't about to commit crime or violent rampage. I went back inside grieving for my poor lost Eunos, youth, and any sign of birthday present deliveries. By The Way Ye gods this is a warm day. Glad I took the day off. Maybe I did get a birthday gift after all? Always look the bright side.
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Let me rephrase my statement. I did not mean to imply that most or even many Romans were not superstitious. Just that a "flat earth" concept would not be held by greek educated romans, as differentiated from the ranks of legions, they however would have been familiar with Eratosthenes and his proof of the earths roundness and his calculation of it's approximate size. I recall seeing a roman coin years ago that had a globe on it. Interesting. However the existence of this knowledge does not prove everyone knew or agreed with it. Despite some rather conclusive proof of Erastjenes ideas, we still have people today who beleive the world is flat. The idea that the average sailor was conversant with what was scientific theory of the time is hard to justify, since they were unlikely to be particularly well educated and almost certainly extremely superstitious as sailors usually are. Further, if you notice, the form of the world the Romans lived in is not discussed widely at all. The truth was that although the greeks had formulated some odd idea that the world was round, the majority of Romans only conceived the world as a place that got increasingly mysterious as you travelled beyond the reach of Rome. With the renaissance Eratosthenes was rediscovered and was the argument used at the Spanish court for not supporting Columbus's request for ships and money. His position was that the earth was narrower east to west than north to south. Eratosthenes only proved its size in the longitude not the latitudes. Columbus knew his argument was unassailable even if he probably didn't believe it. He just had to close the deal. Irrelevant. Don't forget that the divine Julius had landed in britain and that the stories of blood thirsty woad painted savages on chariots with blades in the wheels would have been circulated and no doubt exaggerated by the rank and file. Both heroes and monsters grow in the retelling. Julius Caesar had indeed braved the mysteroies of Britain but that doesn't discount myth. For instance, the US has landed men on the moon but we still read stories of strange faces on its surface or other things that should not be. But more to the point, the Romans had some very deep seated beliefs about crossing water. Fording a river wasn't just a matter of getting your feet wet, but intruding upon the doman of a local god, though I agree individual Romans had a greater or lesser regard for such superstitions. In other words, although the bulk of Britain was still largely unknown and retained its reputation, it was the crossing of the channel and the ensuing temptation of the gods that worried the legions on the shores of Gaul waiting for Caligula to send them across. Caligula was of course merely playing the role of conqueror. For him it was just another game, an interesting idea to exploit, and he was treating his legions as just another toy. Once the legions had expressed their concerns about this expedition - and let's remember how close Caesar came to grief on both his expeditions - Caligula would have been unimpressed by the level of courage and obedience displayed. So instead, he decided that if Britain was protected by Neptune, then Neptune would be made war upon, so he deliberately humiliated his troops by having them collect seashells as booty of the conquest. Then of course he displayed that booty in the senate in order to show the esteemed politicians exactly what sort of stuff their legions were made of. Unfortunately the joke was lost in translation and Suetonius records a mad act instead.
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Slavery will never be fully eradicated. Part of human psychology responds favourably to the idae that people can made to serve at a whim, or be thought of as property. Most of us wouldn't conciously enslave but notice what happens at work if your manager discovers you have influence he doesn't.
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Question about Marian Reforms
caldrail replied to omoplata's topic in Gloria Exercitus - 'Glory of the Army'
Can someone please briefly explain the recruitment practices of the Roman Army before Marius? Ploybius did in some detail. I don't remember off hand whether it was book six or ten of his histories, but it shouldn't be hard to find. What I am trying understand is why there was a property qualification to serve in the army before Marius suspended the property qualification for military service in 107 B.C. That's because the Romans considered that land-owning classes had every reason to volunteer to defend their property. Those without land were of no account. Remember also that Romans soldiers (sorry, 'levies' - Augustus was the first to call legionaries 'soldiers') were expected to to pay for arms and equipment, so obviously the land owning wealthy tended to turn up better equipped than some poor god for nothing who hasn't a sestercii to rub together. Part of the reason I guess is that you wish to ensure the soldiers can afford the military equipment. But if someone shows up with the shield and sword and helmet and so on, which he bought by selling his land or inherited, why did the army care if the person had sufficient land before accepting him into the service? Social status. Martial virtue was highly prized in Roman society and although from our perspective the man who sells his land to buy armour and weaponry is a choice he makes as an individual to perform his part in war, to the Romans he was immediately reduced to a lower class by reducing his circumstances. The Romans were far more concious of social status than we are. Furthermore, who attended to the land of these soldiers while they were away? Did they usually have slaves to take care care of their land while they were on campaign? This was inded a problem for the Romans. While the men were away the land was less likely to be effectively farmed. Although slavery always existed, it wasn't until victory in large scale wars that slaves were available in abundance (It was said the slave market of Delos handled ten thousand slaes of slaves in one day) and only toward the latter half of the Republic was large scale slavery a feature of rural life as the patrons accumulated small armies of servants to handle big country estates. For the legionaries you're discussing, the land would more likely be taken care of by friends and family. In addition, was service in the army primarily a privilege and therefore restricted to higher social classes? Military service was seen as an essential qualification for social status. There are stories of politicians ripping open their toga in the senate to reveal their war wounds, declaring that they had fought for Rome and were entitled to be listened to. If so, what was to be gained from it beyond prestige and honor (which were very significant gains to be sure)? Was there any financial gain to be had from service? Since regular pay was a feature of the post marian era, the ealier legionary had to make do with booty won from the enemy. Pillaging settlements is not an unusual practice for soldiers of any era and the Romans saw no problem with grabbing what they wanted from those that had defied them. In later times, commanders allowed soldiers to sell slaves from the conquered populations, but was this a common practice before the Marian reforms, when soldiers were not dependent on war spoils, financially? Strictly speaking, no. The best example is an event described by Wikipedia as follows... Since 193 BCE, the Lusitanians had been fighting the Romans. In 150 BCE, they were defeated by Praetor Servius Galba: springing a clever trap, he killed 9,000 Lusitanians and later sold 20,000 more as slaves in Gaul. What Servius Galba did was offer a cessation of hostilities to the Lusitanii and told them that if they surrendered their weapons at any of three camps, they could live peacefully as Roman allies with their own land and no hard feelings. Galba was of course lying, and immediately the weapons were surrendered he slaughtered the hapless barbarians and profitted mightily from selling the rest in Rome. In fact, the Senate was outraged by this example of immoral behaviour and had Galba prosecuted. The wily ex-general had his young children brought into the senate house crying their eyes out because they'd been told daddy was to be executed. The senators couldn't bear to see children so upset and so let Galba off. -
Actually I don't happen to believe Columbus was first across the Atlantic. As for the various cultures and factions who have a claim to that prize, I don't know, I haven't seen any overwhelming evidence, though I can accept the Vikings reached Newfoundland as at least potentially possible. However, Columbus wasn't being honest. Clearly he knew, rather than believed,, that a land mass was just over the horizon. it may well be he thought that was the orient, since the idea of a spherical Earth was being discussed from that period. His behaviour as recorded in the story is fairly typical of a sea captain with a hidden rutter (a handbook of handwritten notes and maps pertaining to sea travel, very rare before nautical charts and much prized) to guide him. So who got there before Columbus? No idea. If that happened the unknown captain kept quiet for fear the profit of his discovery would be lost, but that of course raises the question of how the rutter, if it existed, came into Columbus's possession.
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Heve you ever noticed how persitently the civil service agencies tell us how great their customer serrvice is? They hang posters on every wall, print colourful pamphlets, and assure us that everyone is equal and important to the world. The truth, as I've discovered, is that human beings fall well short of government guidelines. Not just the politicians, but those bureaucrats who work on their behalf. I had a drubbing in public from Bovine Betty more than a year ago. I remember her deliberate attempt to shout me down in front of everyone. At the time I could do no more than sit and suffer because she threatened to have me thrown out of the building if I said a word. "You need to mind your manners" She finished with. I reminded her she needed to mind hers. It's very easy to think of these confrontations as something of a competition in which one either wins or loses. I try not to, despite all my instincts screaming for some kind of revenge, yet if these standards of customer service exist, people like Bovine Betty need to understand they are liable for breaches of ettitquette. Today I handed in documents to the Job Centre, a regular formality that's been part of claiming benefits for a while now. Big R has been on the Job Centre team for as long as I've had to suffer unemployment. He's a 'John Prescott' kind of chap, except perhaps not so loud or self important. He accepted my documents and made the error of referring to me as 'Mister'. Sigh. Here we go again. As politely as possible I pointed to my supporting evidence that I ought to be referred to as 'Lord' if spoken to in a formal manner. He looked at me in north-of-england outrage. "You exoect me to call you that?" He said. Yes. "On your bike, you prat!" He spat dismissively, then went of to speak to a security guard for reasons I can only guess at - but ones that are probably obvious. Well. I knew the Job Centre fell short of customer service having already experienced the wrath of the working class claims advisor, but I've been Lord Caldrail for more than eighteen months now. All official. And I note that the only hassle I get is from the Job Centre. It appears that we unemployed people, of whatever background, are really only scumbags and that customer service has face value only. Making The Wold A Better Place Over the weekend I attended a film show and group discussion on how individuals can make positive contributions to society. That isn't the sort of thing I usually get involved with. Not only because as an unemployed person there asre some who regard me as beneath society, but also because such things always seem wishy washy and all rather pointless. The two films were short and sweet. The first was a collage of people from around the world underlining their belief in 'interconnectivity' of the modern world. It was a message of belief that we can all make the world a better place if we respect each other and get along. Clearly the local Job Centre haven't seen it. The discussion seemed to revolve around the concept that mankind was going to evolve spiritually. That somehow the desire to get along will overcome the more worldly motives of the population. You might find this a little strange considering I'm a spiritualist, but I would point out that humans are not exempt from natural processes, and that our primeval ancestory tends to make us do things for our own profit, a corruption of the survival instinct. We're a social animal and as such, we will sooner or later argue over where to put the fence. The United Nations has done its part in preventing another world war, but notice the global escalation of smaller conflicts. It seems interconnecting has both positive and negative aspects. The other film was the story of a lion rescued from it's owner as a cub and reared in a garden until it got too big to keep. With responsible good intentions, the new owners decided it was best if the rapidly growing lion was re-introduced into the wild. So the waved goodbye and left nature to take its course. Some years later they decided to find out what happened to their former pet. Animals touch our hearts all too easily and they simply couldn't forget the short time the lion had been part of their lives. So off they went to Africa, where they were warned that the ion had become master of it's own pride and was probably too dangerous to approach. With some faith in 'interconnectivity' they went ahead nonetheless. The lion saw them, approached, and greeted his former masters with undisguised joy. It was a teary eyed moment - the film really didn't need the tear-jerking music in the background. Perhaps it was just as well the former owners had treated the lion so well it remembered them fondly. Otherwise that could have all gone horribly wrong. Perhaps there's a lesson for the Job Centre in that? The lion is coming back later today.
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Valetudinaria (Military Hospitals):
caldrail replied to guy's topic in Gloria Exercitus - 'Glory of the Army'
In the words of the old joke about the person who was 'other religion' of choice' accepting being given the 'last rites' if everything else has been tried 'Now is not the time to start making enemies!' Glancing through Seutonius it strikes me that some doctors aren't exactly allies to begin with, but I guess that malaise only afflicts the wealthy and their political machinations. Or maybe not? After all, we don't have records of dubious care of soldiers (or civilians of lower stature other than slaves and gladiators, and even then only in connection with important figures) -
The silk road was only open as a safe and established trading route between east and west between ad112 and the retreat of chinese security sometime in the following century (I don't know extacly when). That doesn't mean that trade didn't travel that way before or after, rather that it was the preferred route for a period. It#s also worth noting that goods were transferred between merchants en route rather than going the whole distance in one shot. However, the sporadic visits of chinese merchants to Roman provinces from the 1st century onward means that traxde continued nonetheless, and there were a number of alternative land routes across the middle east. Sea travel was the most persistent means of getting there. The Romans had already established trading links with Taprobane (Sri Lanka) by 85 and a guide to the peoples of the Indian Ocean appeard some fifteen years afterward. Whilst I agree that sailors venturing eastward had profit in mind rather than exploration as a pure objective, there were no nautical charts back then and sailors either had to find local information, investigate a route themselves, or simply grit their teeth and risk all against the hazards of nature and wrath of the gods for being so foolhardy. It wasn't just 'wind regimes' but tides, ocean currents, shallow waters, and reefs to contend with, and despite a century of Hollywood feature films, I doubt sailors weathered storms in the deep ocean all too easily - the Indoian Ocean is notorious for colossal waves - thus a safe anchorage as the weather begins to look dubious would certainly help. They may not have conveived a definite picture of the edges of the earth, but they were keenly aware that they didn't know everything. Caligula's legions were not happy at the prospect of crossing the english channel and invading Britain, largely out of superstition, thus he made them collect seashells on the beaches as a means of berating them for cowardice, though in fairness I doubt Caligula really understood what a serious foreign campaign involved. Whilst the Romans eagerly recorded what they learned of faraway places, there was still a great deal of mystery. As for superstition, it's widely recognised that the Romans were indeed among the superstitious peoples of the world. They were wary of crossing rivers for fear the local gods would get upset, for instance, and why else did they make sacrifices aboard ships before a battle to determine whether they had the gods favour?
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Valetudinaria (Military Hospitals):
caldrail replied to guy's topic in Gloria Exercitus - 'Glory of the Army'
It's also important to realise that a fort with such facilities was a fixed defensive site, and not a temporary marching camp. There's no dispute that such facilities existed in permanent stations, but I doubt many of us would be happy with the standard of health care. Would you be confident with doctor whp prays for your health to get better? -
Did the Roman Legions adopt Pankration?
caldrail replied to a topic in Gloria Exercitus - 'Glory of the Army'
'Martial Arts' is a modern phrase and anachrinistic when used in reference to the Romans. However, regarding the passage you quoted, that does not equate to the pancration. The greeks invented that form of competition as an athletic sport, not a combat style, and given they took the attitude that winning was everything and losers can limp away loathed and despised, it follows they thought of wrestling with almost no holds barred. I have no doubt that Roman soldiers engaged in bouts of wrestling from time to time. That was considered a manly pursuit and indeed, note your quotation applauds his skills at it. It must be understood however that Roman soldiers were not athletes, who generally took on the stigma of slavery and infamy in Roman circles, and that the idea of rebdering your opponent too severely injured to continue (the whole point of pancration was to win mercilessly) did not lend itself to Roman policy of fitness, virility, and latin conformity. Also, be aware that these sort of descriptions are often written to underline the special nature of the individual, and there's no guarantee that the prose was not an exaggeration, something Roman writers often indulged in. -
Strictly speaking he didn't. All he proved was that modern sea travellers could take a reproduction of an egyptian papyrus boat across the Atlantic. Bear in mind that the knoweldge of mariners in those times lacked a certain background and sophistication, not to mention modern era overight/rescue, and some idea of where they were going. I'm not disputing the sailors of the ancient world weren't skilled as voyages across the Indian Ocean are known to have been a regular occurence once the silk road was closed due to barbarian interdiction and the failure of the chinese to maintain security in the Tarim Basin during the 3rd century, more or a less a century after the Silk Road was regarded as open for business. However we do have to realise that geograhical information was not so easily had back then. I'm thinking in terms of a phoenician captain who was followed by a Roman ship toward Britain. The phoenicians beached their ship rather than reveal the harbour they were intending to trade with and the captain received a reward for his foresight and courage in denying the Romans the secret of the trading post. The question of superstition also has an impact. Whereas the chritian view held that the world had an edge and if one sailed too far, you went off the surface of the sea, the ancients did not have such a boundary in mind. However, the unknown reaches were very much a consideration. Most vessels did not sail all day and night for fear of accident, and would find a safe anchorage along the coastline to set out again at first light/morning tide. For that reason alone the exploration of the Indian Ocean was a gradual affair but one that gave sailors confidence that they knew where to go. With the Atlantic - there was nothing but water. I'm not discounting the possibility of long distance travel in ancient times. There is persistent urban legend to that effect though no-one has yet convincingly argued that this was achieved, never mind on a regular basis, and even the journey around Africa by ship has been called into question. The use of re-enactment such as Thor Heyedahls journey provides useful practical knowledge about sea travel in those days but in no way does it prove that the Egyptians were capable of crossing the Atlantic.